for the positive ND fan

[mick2]

all good points dre.

i wish i had the energy to write something as well said as that. but i don't so i guess we'll wait and see.

 

[dre1919]

Haha...thanks Mick. The thing is, ask yourself this about Charlie:

Let's say he didn't have a well prepared and matured offense in place when he got to South Bend. Let's pretend he had last years offense with all the youth and no upperclassmen to learn from. This would be year four and there would be no back-to-back BCS berths, and that very same offense would be Seniors now. Sure, they would be good in theory...as this offense should be when they get to being Seniors. But, four years in with three of them being like last year and this year so far...wouldn't he be on the "Hot Seat"? I say his "success" has more to do with having really good personnel he could take to he next level immediately than having kids he trained up from the beginning. However, like it or not, we'll see that scenario play out because he has Freshmen and Sophomores. He has top recruiting classes...he has "his" guys. So, in the next two years, we better be back in BCS bowls and producing a top offense (like the last two of the Quinn Years) or his tenure was a failure. Plain and simple.

 

[GO IRISH!!!]

I don't argue for the sake of arguing. I state the facts. If you can't deal with it then don't post. I am an ND fan just like any one of you here, but it seems that the people who are over dosing on the kool-aid far out number the people who are severely pissed off about whats happening now.

I am not so sure about what is more respectable, going 3-9 with one of the hardest schedules in the country, or 10-2 with one of the weakest.

Either way mick2, stop calling me out. I'm not sure why you are so angry with me when I post my opinions. Clearly I am not the only one who shares them. I feel bad that your delusions of winning a NC this year have been crushed, but facts are facts.

And to that other clown, I never said ND sucks. But its clearly not the team that most of us were expecting this year.

I am just curious - you say at the beginning that you state the facts, but then in the next breath say you are posting your opinions. Why are your opinions rational and fact based, but people that have a more positive outlook are "drinking the kool-aid"? By the way, I vote for abolishing the cliche relating to the Kool-Aid. (For the record, Kool-Aid is a damn fine beverage that mixes splendidly with vodka and it does not deserve to be degraded in that way!)

I have wondered this same thing on this site and other sites as well: Why does being negative and talking how bad your team is make you so much more knowlegeable and wise than those of us who are more rah-rah and upbeat?

I don't have a problem with you posting your opinions - you are entitled and encouraged to do so. The problem I have is with the elitist tone you often have in your posts that tends to degrade and trivialize the opinions others have. Post your opinions and state the facts, if you will, but don't claim that others are, in any way, unable to think for themselves and arrive at equally insightful and lucid decisions just because their outlook is more positive than yours.

 

[mick2]

Haha...thanks Mick. The thing is, ask yourself this about Charlie:

Let's say he didn't have a well prepared and matured offense in place when he got to South Bend. Let's pretend he had last years offense with all the youth and no upperclassmen to learn from. This would be year four and there would be no back-to-back BCS berths, and that very same offense would be Seniors now. Sure, they would be good in theory...as this offense should be when they get to being Seniors. But, four years in with three of them being like last year and this year so far...wouldn't he be on the "Hot Seat"? I say his "success" has more to do with having really good personnel he could take to he next level immediately than having kids he trained up from the beginning. However, like it or not, we'll see that scenario play out because he has Freshmen and Sophomores. He has top recruiting classes...he has "his" guys. So, in the next two years, we better be back in BCS bowls and producing a top offense (like the last two of the Quinn Years) or his tenure was a failure. Plain and simple.

yes but also ask yourself, what if charlie had come in right after davie was fired instead of willingham, i believe we would have won an NC with brady and be working on going after it again by now.

BUT.....if my aunt had nuts shed be my uncle.

So i fully believe that next year will be a good year but 2010 is when we really vie fo another NC, and from 2010 on we compete for it every year much like sc has the last near decade.

 

[no.1IrishFan]

I don't argue for the sake of arguing. I state the facts. If you can't deal with it then don't post. I am an ND fan just like any one of you here, but it seems that the people who are over dosing on the kool-aid far out number the people who are severely pissed off about whats happening now.

I am not so sure about what is more respectable, going 3-9 with one of the hardest schedules in the country, or 10-2 with one of the weakest.

Either way mick2, stop calling me out. I'm not sure why you are so angry with me when I post my opinions. Clearly I am not the only one who shares them. I feel bad that your delusions of winning a NC this year have been crushed, but facts are facts.

And to that other clown, I never said ND sucks. But its clearly not the team that most of us were expecting this year.

Listen bro I dont have a problem with you stating your so called facts, I actually agree with a good number of your posts. The problem is that I only see you focusing on the negative when there is more to this team than just bad things. If you cannot see improvement in this years team than something is wrong with you, sorry if it is not the amount of improvement you feel it should be.Im not the kind of person who would normally call someone out in a post like I did but you did not belong in that thread in the first place. It was labeled:THE POSITIVE ND FAN.

 

[phork]

no1.irishfan:

So I pose this question to you as well. How would this team fair (2008) with the first 3 games of last year, in your mind? GT, UM, PSU vs SDSU, UM, MSU.

 

[no.1IrishFan]

no1.irishfan:

So I pose this question to you as well. How would this team fair (2008) with the first 3 games of last year, in your mind? GT, UM, PSU vs SDSU, UM, MSU.

All 3 would have still been losses, but you cant just judge the development of the team by last years schedule. I believe that last years team would have also lost all 3 of the games this year but we are 2-1........thats called improvement.

 

[NDMontana]

All 3 would have still been losses, but you cant just judge the development of the team by last years schedule. I believe that last years team would have also lost all 3 of the games this year but we are 2-1........thats called improvement.

I would like to believe that under no circumstances would ND lose to San Diego State, especially after they were beaten by an FCS team the prior week. I think that the 2007 incarnation of ND Football would have beaten SDSU.

 

[SteveM]

Go Abyssinia - Beat Il Duce!

Go Abyssinia - Beat Il Duce!

I would like to believe that under no circumstances would ND lose to San Diego State, especially after they were beaten by an FCS team the prior week. I think that the 2007 incarnation of ND Football would have beaten SDSU.

NDM,

That's like forecasting the Italians defeating the spear chucking Ethiopians in 1935.

SteveM

 

[no.1IrishFan]

I would like to believe that under no circumstances would ND lose to San Diego State, especially after they were beaten by an FCS team the prior week. I think that the 2007 incarnation of ND Football would have beaten SDSU.

Well sdsu did control almost all of the game until the 4th qtr. I dont know if last year we would have pulled the come from behind. On the basis that we are better this year than last year I have to call that one a loss.

 

[mick2]

Phork why do you keep going back to last year? give that argument a rest already, it sounds like you're just hoping the irish fall apart so you can be "right"

last year is over, we are 2-1 this year, which puts us in the same boat as a lot of teams.

i think you think the more positive fans on here are just blindly backing weis and the product on the field, but that is not true. until our team proves otherwise i go into the game knowing that our team could quite possibly lose but believing that they will win.

i see that we can't run the ball, i see our line isn't blowing the dline off the ball, i've played football. so i see it and i also see that all of the problems are technical not because of lack of talent and they can all be fixed and will be fixed.

 

[phork]

I bring it up, because you guys keep saying there has been this sizable improvement. I don't see it. Funny, though the same problems as last year, are here this year. Offense can't sustain drives, defense on the field a long time, can't stop the run, can't run... Its all a little broken recordish..

 

[NDinL.A.]

I bring it up, because you guys keep saying there has been this sizable improvement. I don't see it. Funny, though the same problems as last year, are here this year. Offense can't sustain drives, defense on the field a long time, can't stop the run, can't run... Its all a little broken recordish..

There are major improvements. Last year Clausen couldn't breathe without getting hammered by a rush. We have a QB this year that can really wing it (wonderful zip on his passes), we have 2 monster receivers that all-american written all over them. We have a defense that is much improved against the pass.

I'm not a straight numbers guy. I watch the team and I see improvement w/ my owns eyes, stats be damned. Last year Mich St. would have beaten us by 35+. Easily. This year we were in the game until the last 4 minutes. There is much to look forward to.

Now, I'm not drinking the 'Aid, and thinking we're there and this is a great start. Hell no. I can't even begin to tell you have disappointed I am in the D-Line, and the O-Line's lack of any killer instinct. But from 3-9, I like what I see from the young talent we have, and they're going to get better...

 

[mick2]

I bring it up, because you guys keep saying there has been this sizable improvement. I don't see it. Funny, though the same problems as last year, are here this year. Offense can't sustain drives, defense on the field a long time, can't stop the run, can't run... Its all a little broken recordish..

funny you should say "broken recordish", because your argument has been the same for the last 50 posts!

the positives on this team really outweigh the negatives, end of story.

 

[phork]

Well then mick2 considering that you know everything there is to know (just ask you), I will refrain from submitting posts in which you are involved. Clearly, sir, you are the best.

 

[NDOM]

Group hug everyone! I love you Mick2! I love you phork! lol. Its gameday guys. Lets bash purDONT not eachother. Wait till we at least lose first!!! ha ha ha J/K

 

[amusedtodeathdogs]

thing`s are getting better, i see us winning enough games for a lower echelon bowl and winning it to get that monkey off our back.next year a big bowl maybe even a bcs game and then back on track for national championship and the return of our storied program to promenance,hell we are notre dame it`s our destiny