Agree to Disagree

[jerseyborn1971]

In the interest of saving time and stopping useless argument before they start, let's agree that we all fall into 1 of 2 categories on a number of issues. When the subjects come up in threads, we can just respond (a) or (b).

Issue #1: Notre Dame's Defense.
(a) It's gotten worse since CW got here but will get better with new recruits and fire Minter.
(b) The defense needs a lot of work with scheming and talent, but has improved slightly since CW got here. MInter only needs to be fired if 2-3 years from now we've seen no improvement.

Issue #2: Brady Quinn
(a) He's good against nobodies, but plays terrible in big games.
(b) The guy has been the most important player for us the last 2 years, broken virtually every record at ND, would be a legend at ND if we don't give up 4th and 9, and played 1 statistically bad game in the last 2 years. The rest of his "bad games" were more the result of a poor defense giving up tons of points than anything else.

Issue #3: CW can't win the big game
(a) He's only beaten nobodies. He can't beat a Top 5 team.
(b) He beat the #3 team in the country in his 3rd game. That team went on to be 7-5, but at the time of the game, it was a "big game" meaning the media and fans alike put pressure on the situation. He later was a bush Push away from his 2nd "big game" win. We are not ones for moral victories, but we took the team that smoked TY by 31 in every game he coached to the brink. He took a "mediocre" team and all but beat the "greatest college team" ever. Plus, he's only had 4 chances to even play in a so-called "big game" against teams he was out matched against to begin with.

Issue #4: The SEC
(a) The SEC is the greatest conference in College Football.
(b) The SEC is over-rated, NOT the best conference, and hides behind their " in conf schedule is brutal we don't have to play OOC games" excuse.

Issue #5: ESPN
(a) ESPN is so biased and unfair, they hate us, Mark May is an ass, etc
(b) I don't watch that garbage channel.

Issue #6: Darius Walker
(a) He's too slow and should be replaced.
(b) He's been a steady performer and takes advantage of what he does best.

I'm sure there are a few more, feel free to add.

 

[AlbuquerqueIrishFan]

I choose the following:

Issue #1: Notre Dame's Defense.
(b) The defense needs a lot of work with scheming and talent, but has improved slightly since CW got here. MInter only needs to be fired if 2-3 years from now we've seen no improvement.

Issue #2: Brady Quinn
(b) The guy has been the most important player for us the last 2 years, broken virtually every record at ND, would be a legend at ND if we don't give up 4th and 9, and played 1 statistically bad game in the last 2 years. The rest of his "bad games" were more the result of a poor defense giving up tons of points than anything else.

Issue #3: CW can't win the big game
At this point it's true, but once he gets his guys in, he'll win 'em all. The win at Michigan last year doesn't count as that team lost 7 games.

Issue #4: The SEC
(a) The SEC is the greatest conference in College Football.

Issue #5: ESPN
I like ESPN and think we will get plenty of publicity when we start to have success and beat USC.

Issue #6: Darius Walker
(a) He's too slow and should be replaced.

 

[jerseyborn1971]

I'd say you are pretty much an (a) on #3 and (c) on #5. I've never heard anyone on this board say they like ESPN.

 

[GoshenGipper]

1. (a) I don't think it's gotten worse, but I think we should've seen more improvemnet by now.

2. (b)

3. (b) He will beat more elite teams when he has 3 to 4 of his own recruiting classes in the fold. It's not his fault that the wheels fall off of teams season's after ND beats them.

4. (b) There can be dominate teams in the SEC just like every other major conference, but it's not head and shoulders above everyone every year like some would lead you to believe. Some have even gone as far to say a team like S. Carolina that finished 4th in the SEC(East) would win the Big Ten, or Big 12, and they are only a few plays away from Glenndale.

5. (A!)

6. (b) I think it would've helped if TT would have been able to play more RB this year.

 

[Aerosmith777]

Issue #1: B (but I think Minter should be fired after next year if there is not legitimate improvement-not talking top 10 here, just top 35 would do for me)

Issue #2: B

Issue #3: B

Issue #4: Eh, C: The SEC is the best conference most years, but gets overrated by the media often (like this year)

Issue #5: Well, A & B for that one

Issue #6: B

 

[Aerosmith777]

I'd say you are pretty much an (a) on #3 and (c) on #5. I've never heard anyone on this board say they like ESPN.

He is right on one thing though. Notre Dame is always only an undefeated season away from getting slurped by ESPN so much it will make us all nausseous that these were the same people trashing it just a few years before.

 

[solo]

I'd say you are pretty much an (a) on #3 and (c) on #5. I've never heard anyone on this board say they like ESPN.

You must have forgotten about me. I love ESPN. But I can't stand Mark May. And as you can tell, I LOVE a good debate. So I hope that people don't take things too personal. I just think it's fun to get on here and debate.argue.

And admittedly, though I am a huge ND fan, I am also very critical of ND football.

 

[ND81]

Issue #5

A) What can you say about a group that prematurely begins to anoint one team the best of all time? That month long poll last year in which they put the 2005 USC team against other great teams of the past was ridiculous.

And to a certain extent

B) I watch only for highlights and scores, I don't have much patience for a Tuesday night game featuring Ohio and Toledo.

 

[connor_in]

He is right on one thing though. Notre Dame is always only an undefeated season away from getting slurped by ESPN so much it will make us all nausseous that these were the same people trashing it just a few years before.

I doubt ESPN will ever slurp us. Its OK, but you have to realize their biases. ND is one of their biggest biases against and it is more than likely a business one. "ND has its own network!" is the cry, so ESPN never comes to South Bend, doesn't get to play all the reindeer games as far as super close ties to the University and all that...basically, sour grapes is the reason for the bias

 

[solo]

I doubt ESPN will ever slurp us. Its OK, but you have to realize their biases. ND is one of their biggest biases against and it is more than likely a business one. "ND has its own network!" is the cry, so ESPN never comes to South Bend, doesn't get to play all the reindeer games as far as super close ties to the University and all that...basically, sour grapes is the reason for the bias

You don't think the "bias" has anything to do with our underachievement on the field for the last decade? ND is a hype machine and we haven't lived up to the hype for longer than I care to admit.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

In the interest of saving time and stopping useless argument before they start, let's agree that we all fall into 1 of 2 categories on a number of issues. When the subjects come up in threads, we can just respond (a) or (b).

Issue #1: Notre Dame's Defense.
(a) It's gotten worse since CW got here but will get better with new recruits and fire Minter.
(b) The defense needs a lot of work with scheming and talent, but has improved slightly since CW got here. MInter only needs to be fired if 2-3 years from now we've seen no improvement.

Issue #2: Brady Quinn
(a) He's good against nobodies, but plays terrible in big games.
(b) The guy has been the most important player for us the last 2 years, broken virtually every record at ND, would be a legend at ND if we don't give up 4th and 9, and played 1 statistically bad game in the last 2 years. The rest of his "bad games" were more the result of a poor defense giving up tons of points than anything else.

Issue #3: CW can't win the big game
(a) He's only beaten nobodies. He can't beat a Top 5 team.
(b) He beat the #3 team in the country in his 3rd game. That team went on to be 7-5, but at the time of the game, it was a "big game" meaning the media and fans alike put pressure on the situation. He later was a bush Push away from his 2nd "big game" win. We are not ones for moral victories, but we took the team that smoked TY by 31 in every game he coached to the brink. He took a "mediocre" team and all but beat the "greatest college team" ever. Plus, he's only had 4 chances to even play in a so-called "big game" against teams he was out matched against to begin with.

Issue #4: The SEC
(a) The SEC is the greatest conference in College Football.
(b) The SEC is over-rated, NOT the best conference, and hides behind their " in conf schedule is brutal we don't have to play OOC games" excuse.

Issue #5: ESPN
(a) ESPN is so biased and unfair, they hate us, Mark May is an ass, etc
(b) I don't watch that garbage channel.

Issue #6: Darius Walker
(a) He's too slow and should be replaced.
(b) He's been a steady performer and takes advantage of what he does best.

I'm sure there are a few more, feel free to add.

Best post ever...hahahahahaha

I would add a lot of C's in there though, the world is not quite that black and white.

 

[jerseyborn1971]

Best post ever...hahahahahaha

I would add a lot of C's in there though, the world is not quite that black and white.

Oh, there are some D's, E's & All of the Above's I'm sure.

 

[GoshenGipper]

You don't think the "bias" has anything to do with our underachievement on the field for the last decade? ND is a hype machine and we haven't lived up to the hype for longer than I care to admit.

Maybe a little bit, but not most of it. It's hard to believe that when there are people like Dave Revsine on ESPNEWS going nuts and almost falling out of his chair because that analyst didn't feel as stongly as him about Notre Dame being overrated. He just kept repeating "But who have they played?!". This was just after ND went 4-1 against GT, PSU, UM, MSU, and PU. If I was the analyst I would have given him the opportunity to list any of the other 116 Div1A schools that he thought had a harder schedule through they first five games.

 

[Aerosmith777]

Yeah, I'd disagree that ESPN's bias has everything to do w/ actual play on the field, but I'd also disagree that ESPN wouldn't slurp ND the way they do OSU and USC if ND ever went undefeated.

ESPN can't live in grey areas, especially w/ lighting rod teams like Notre Dame. Notre Dame can't just be a decent team to ESPN, either they're the greatest team in history (I guaruntee you would start hearing that if they have an undefeated year w/ Clausen at the helm) or they're overrated and they belong in the Poinsettia Bowl but got into the BCS "only because they're Notre Dame." The idea that Notre Dame was the best eligible team left, after all the other schools in the BCS got their bids, in a year where college football really is kinda down just doesn't fly on ESPN. #1, they'd never admit this has been a down year for college football in terms of how many good teams there are out there. And #2, they're just incapable of taking that sort of middle-of-the-road stance on Notre Dame. It's always all or nothing. And if ND ever went undefeated, it'd be all real quick.

 

[rontdtarchala]

a-a-a-b-a-b

 

[jiggafini19]

Demetrius Jones

a. once slammed a revolving door
b. gave Mona Lisa her smile
c. drives an ice cream truck covered with the helmets of his victims
d. is gonna make a damn fine wide receiver at Notre Dame or wherever he transfers

 

[solo]

Demetrius Jones

a. once slammed a revolving door
b. gave Mona Lisa her smile
c. drives an ice cream truck covered with the helmets of his victims
d. is gonna make a damn fine wide receiver at Notre Dame or wherever he transfers

Does ND accept transfers for athletes?

 

[jerseyborn1971]

Demetrius Jones

a. once slammed a revolving door
b. gave Mona Lisa her smile
c. drives an ice cream truck covered with the helmets of his victims
d. is gonna make a damn fine wide receiver at Notre Dame or wherever he transfers

I'm torn between b & d. Buuuuuuuut, I'll go wiiiith.....D!