Funny Picture...Enjoy

[VictorsValiant]

 

[Vince Young]

Vanderbilt, Central Michigan, Minnesota, Northwestern, Ball State and Indiana... enjoy!

 

[BGIF]

Lest we forget 10/7, MSU

 

[Vince Young]

Lest we forget 10/7, MSU

I thought about that one, but that's one of those solid throw-out-the-records sort of rivalries. They've spoiled their share of Wolverine seasons.

 

[BGIF]

I thought about that one, but that's one of those solid throw-out-the-records sort of rivalries. They've spoiled their share of Wolverine seasons.

I'm just going by the list of cupcakes Victor served up.

 

[maison bleu]

What does it mean that one of the ND cupcakes (Navy) routed one of the other cupcakes (Stanford) by a score of 37-9.

Shouldn't Stanford be demoted to "cruller" or "scone" or some other lesser pastry?

 

[Aaronl]

air force looked pretty good at Tennessee

 

[TexasDomer]

Yes, opening against a Ga Tech team that beat Va Tech in Blacksburg, a common opponent in Penn State, the Wolverines, and a common opponent in MSU and a pretty good Purdue offensive team is ignored. As is the season ender at SC, every bit as challenging as OSU.

We've got Army. You've got Ball State. Push.
We've got Air Force. You've got Northwestern. Push
We've got North Carolina. You've got Indiana. Push.

Whoever is at Michigan needs to read the bible verse about specks and logs in eyes.

 

[marv81s]

Not sure how you can call Navy and Air Force cupcakes. The way they run the ball, they can keep opposing teams offenses off the field for at least half the game. Ask Tenn how big of a cupcake AF was. Lost two big starters in that game. We'll see how the season plays out and who ended up with a bigger cupcake schedule.

 

[irish4life99]

Is this troll serious? I think the UM and ND SOS are pretty much the same. Actually, I give ND the slight edge this year. I'm not going to waste my time pointing out the obvious in the schedule. If this person really thinks this then there is little we can do to help him.

When ignorance and hate is your master then peace is unitainable.

 

[scooper]

Nobody played a tougher September than ND. The Big Televens of the world hit their cupcakes early while ND plays the meat of their schedule.

 

[maison bleu]

Is this troll serious? I think the UM and ND SOS are pretty much the same. Actually, I give ND the slight edge this year. I'm not going to waste my time pointing out the obvious in the schedule. If this person really thinks this then there is little we can do to help him.

When ignorance and hate is your master then peace is unitainable.

I think VV is joking only about the next section of the Irish schedule, not the whole thing.

You're right, ND's schedule this year, and Michigan's, are pretty close.

And what's this about "ignorance and hate"? Did you misplace your sense of humor?

 

[Aerosmith777]

Oh, calm down guys. I thought it was pretty funny to be honest, I don't think he meant to spark a serious discussion on SOS on this post.

And to whoever questionned whether Navy is a cupcake, I understand the way they run the ball, I understand how they're always a bowl team, I get it. But seriously, how can we not call a team the Irish have beaten every year for over 4 decades a cupcake?

 

[irish9331]

What does it mean that one of the ND cupcakes (Navy) routed one of the other cupcakes (Stanford) by a score of 37-9.

Shouldn't Stanford be demoted to "cruller" or "scone" or some other lesser pastry?

Well the history of ND and Navy is well documented and the Stanford game is a Trophy game that started when Stanford was a power. It is not ND's fault that the talent level there has fallen off. Michigan has its share of cupcakes also.

 

[VictorsValiant]

I was being half-humorous and half-serious at the same time.

It's true that the two schedules are similar, but that's besides the point.

No team other than Nd has a clause in the BCS contract that GUARENTEES a BCS game if the team loses 2 or fewer games. No other team with two losses would automatically be considered for a BCS game, including us, USC, Texas, OSU or any other "power" teams that might get some preferential treatment. The point is that these cupcakes almost mean that Nd is backing themselves into a BCS game and perhaps closing the door on a deserving SEC team whose losses are not as decisive or a Cinderella like Boise State. Of course, all of this is going under the assumption that you will be killed by USC, which I suspect is highly likely at this point.

 

[HereComeTheIrish]

I was being half-humorous and half-serious at the same time.

It's true that the two schedules are similar, but that's besides the point.

No team other than Nd has a clause in the BCS contract that GUARENTEES a BCS game if the team loses 2 or fewer games. No other team with two losses would automatically be considered for a BCS game, including us, USC, Texas, OSU or any other "power" teams that might get some preferential treatment. The point is that these cupcakes almost mean that Nd is backing themselves into a BCS game and perhaps closing the door on a deserving SEC team whose losses are not as decisive or a Cinderella like Boise State. Of course, all of this is going under the assumption that you will be killed by USC, which I suspect is highly likely at this point.

Tell you what...Become an independant and stop hiding behind the Indianas, Minnesotas, Illinois, Northwesterns and Purdues of the world on top of playing that piece of crap non-conference schedule your "fellas" play and then have the balls to discredit our schedule. I realize that we don't have any of the mid-major Michigan schools to deal with as you have to on a yearly basis...(Thank God...thay can be a bear), but for Christ sakes stop your whining. Do better than a half of a championship anytime soon and perhaps the skunkbears would gain one ounce of credibility. Otherwise, stop whining and get ready to become the Suckeyes "Lovesponge" come November 18th. Sweet dreams...

 

[lattedatte]

I was being half-humorous and half-serious at the same time.

It's true that the two schedules are similar, but that's besides the point.

No team other than Nd has a clause in the BCS contract that GUARENTEES a BCS game if the team loses 2 or fewer games. No other team with two losses would automatically be considered for a BCS game, including us, USC, Texas, OSU or any other "power" teams that might get some preferential treatment. The point is that these cupcakes almost mean that Nd is backing themselves into a BCS game and perhaps closing the door on a deserving SEC team whose losses are not as decisive or a Cinderella like Boise State. Of course, all of this is going under the assumption that you will be killed by USC, which I suspect is highly likely at this point.

you are just flat out wrong, conference champions have it just as easy (if not easier). I site florida st last year..... A 4 loss ND team would never have a shot at a BCS game..

 

[VictorsValiant]

What's the difference between Ball State/Central Michigan and Army/Stanford? Stanford may sound sexier, but that doesn't make them better. Nor does your annual game with Navy. Nor does Army, Air Force or North Carolina (three teams that have ALWAYS been mediocre at best).

What troubles me is the guarentee clause. I don't know how long this takes effect, but it serves an an INCENTIVE for Nd to schedule weaker opponents just to get to BCS games. Whereas Nd used to play good teams, they now play mostly mediocre/bad teams. I think the clause (which does not apply to anyone else), contributed to this schedule. Also, don't give me that crap about how you never know how your teams are when you actually play them because you scheduled them before. Track record matters. Why didn't you schedule UCLA last year when they were actually good. Why was Boston College taken off the schedule? Like I said, Army/Navy/Air Force/North Carolina/Stanford have always been mediocre at best. I'm not trying to compare schedules. I'm simply saying the guarentee clause shouldn't be there. Nd gets enough hype already (as evidenced by their horrible streak of bowl losses, indicative of the fact that you're always placed in bowls against better opponents), so they don't need this. The guarentee clause essentially takes away the incentive of Nd scheduling difficult oppoents, which certainly was the case in the past but not so much today.

 

[lattedatte]

What's the difference between Ball State/Central Michigan and Army/Stanford? Stanford may sound sexier, but that doesn't make them better. Nor does your annual game with Navy. Nor does Army, Air Force or North Carolina (three teams that have ALWAYS been mediocre at best).

What troubles me is the guarentee clause. I don't know how long this takes effect, but it serves an an INCENTIVE for Nd to schedule weaker opponents just to get to BCS games. Whereas Nd used to play good teams, they now play mostly mediocre/bad teams. I think the clause (which does not apply to anyone else), contributed to this schedule. Also, don't give me that crap about how you never know how your teams are when you actually play them because you scheduled them before. Track record matters. Why didn't you schedule UCLA last year when they were actually good. Why was Boston College taken off the schedule? Like I said, Army/Navy/Air Force/North Carolina/Stanford have always been mediocre at best. I'm not trying to compare schedules. I'm simply saying the guarentee clause shouldn't be there. Nd gets enough hype already (as evidenced by their horrible streak of bowl losses, indicative of the fact that you're always placed in bowls against better opponents), so they don't need this. The guarentee clause essentially takes away the incentive of Nd scheduling difficult oppoents, which certainly was the case in the past but not so much today.

then no gaurantee clauses should exist, period... but as long as you have a gaurantee cluse for the conf. champions then ND deserves one too..

 

[VictorsValiant]

I actually don't have a problem with that. While it's true that each major conference does indeed produce a noteworthy BCS candidate an overwhelming majority of years, it's also true that a FSU (last year), or a Big East team takes away the position of another, more worthy team. For the record, the Big East should be shut out of the automatic BCS bid, in my opinion.

However, the conference guarentees apply to ALL CONFERENCE TEAMS. They are not geared towards one team, which is the case with Nd. By your logic, Navy, Army, Temple and other independents deserve this exception as well. In an overwhelming majority of years, you are always going to have strong teams in conference, meaning you ALWAYS play hard games every year. On the other hand, Nd has the luxury of cherrypicking teams that sound sexy (Stanford, Syracuse, UCLA after a good year, PSU after a good year), but are actually rebuilding for one season. This allows them to intentionally fluff the schedule to get the BCS guarentee.

It would be one thing if Nd was not nationally known, if they didn't have their games broadcast by one network, or if they were shut out of BCS games unfairly. Of course, we all know this is not the case. Nd is so hyped as it is, it's hard to imagine how they could be shut out of a BCS game if the guarentee clause wasn't there. If anything, it's easy to imagine why they don't belong.

 

[lattedatte]

I actually don't have a problem with that. While it's true that each major conference does indeed produce a noteworthy BCS candidate an overwhelming majority of years, it's also true that a FSU (last year), or a Big East team takes away the position of another, more worthy team. For the record, the Big East should be shut out of the automatic BCS bid, in my opinion.

However, the conference guarentees apply to ALL CONFERENCE TEAMS. They are not geared towards one team, which is the case with Nd. By your logic, Navy, Army, Temple and other independents deserve this exception as well. In an overwhelming majority of years, you are always going to have strong teams in conference, meaning you ALWAYS play hard games every year. On the other hand, Nd has the luxury of cherrypicking teams that sound sexy (Stanford, Syracuse, UCLA after a good year, PSU after a good year), but are actually rebuilding for one season. This allows them to intentionally fluff the schedule to get the BCS guarentee.

It would be one thing if Nd was not nationally known, if they didn't have their games broadcast by one network, or if they were shut out of BCS games unfairly. Of course, we all know this is not the case. Nd is so hyped as it is, it's hard to imagine how they could be shut out of a BCS game if the guarentee clause wasn't there. If anything, it's easy to imagine why they don't belong.

ND's schedules are made well in advance of one year. UCLA and PSU both have been scheduled for like 5-7 years. So we don't cherry pick, ever. I don't see how you couldn't say we don't year in and year out have a schedule that is among the toughest in the country. Now that schedule in a given year may not turn out to be one of the toughest, like last year. But with the likes of Mich, USC, Mich St, Purdue, Pitt on it nearly every year. I would put those 5 against any conference top 5. Do we have some easy games, sure, but what team doesn't. We deserve it, couldn't disagree more.

 

[VictorsValiant]

I'm not saying or implying that Nd doesn't deserve to be in BCS games. During the 90s and before, Nd did indeed have one of the toughest schedules in the country. I will not dispute that. However, I have noticed a drop off the past few years, and I think the guarentee clause contributes to it. I mean, if you can lose 2, you can schedule 3 hard games (us, USC and for now I'd say GTech was legit), and you only have to win one and take care of business against everyone else. Now, I can't prove that Nd is trying to schedule soft because of the guarentee clause, but it's interesting nevertheless.

One way to rectify my concerns would be to schedules teams like PSU for four seasons. That way, you go through a cycle. Also, I think the North Carolinas, MSUs and Purdues of the world are solid middle of the road teams. Having good but not great teams, like Boston College, Iowa or Oregon on the schedule would also mollify concerns that the schedule is simply 3 hard games and all easy games after that.

 

[lattedatte]

Please look at ND's 2008 schedule, just look at the first 8 games next year, seriously dude that might be the hardest schedule in the history of college football...
2008
9-1 Georgia Tech
9-8 @ Penn State
9-15 @ Michigan
9-22 Michigan State
9-29 @ Purdue
10-6 @ UCLA
10-13 Boston College
10-20 Southern California
11-3 Navy
11-10 Air Force
11-17 Duke
11-24 @ Stanford

 

[HereComeTheIrish]

I actually don't have a problem with that. While it's true that each major conference does indeed produce a noteworthy BCS candidate an overwhelming majority of years, it's also true that a FSU (last year), or a Big East team takes away the position of another, more worthy team. For the record, the Big East should be shut out of the automatic BCS bid, in my opinion.

And quite frankly, 9 of the 11 teams in "The Integer" ought to be shut out of the automatic BCS bid.

 

[lattedatte]

Just so you know that nd doesn't "cherry pick" here is the 2013 slated games thus far, thats right 2013. If you guys don't puss out of playing us like BO said, we would have Oklahoma, USC and Michigan on one years schedule with the likes of Ariz st, Pitt and BC. note this is 7 years away and we already have 9 games set. So your argument that we have lightened our schedule since the BCS gaurantee just is wrong. last year the schedule just sort played out that way. Sorry man.

9-7 Oklahoma
10-5 Arizona State
11-9 @ Pittsburgh
TBA Southern California
TBA Navy
TBA Boston College
TBA @ Brigham Young
TBA @ Purdue
TBA Rutgers

 

[VictorsValiant]

A team's track record matters. Even if you plan it out years in advance, those teams are still going to have histories. In 2013, Michigan/Oklahoma/USC will probably be good, while Navy/BYU will probably be bad.

Let's try to come up with a system to assess the schedule. I think most team can be broken down into five tiers.

5-Exceptional. Always in the top 10 most years. Is perinnel contender almost every season. Strong tradition.

4-Good but not great. Always in top 25, but rarely in top 10 at end of year. Has solid record of 8 or more wins, but cannot defeat tier 1 teams on a consistent basis. Very hard time rising to the top in the conference (Examples include BC, Iowa, Oregon)

3-Average. Sometimes in top 25, always in bowl. Has record of 6 or more wins most of the time, but rarely defeats tier 1 teams and only sometimes defeats tier 2 teams. Inconsistent, unstable coaching at times. Hit or miss recruiting.

2-Below Average. Rarely in top 25, only sometimes in bowl. Sometimes has winning record, but always at bottom half of conference. Difficulty maintaining consistentcy, coaching instablity common, interest level low from institution and fans. Can never break through with recruiting.

1-Why the hell do you have a football program? Never in top 25 or bowl. Always a doormat for conference teams. Instability everywhere, from recruiting to coaching.

So, with that basis, let's assess your schedule for this year and next compared to ours. I will base my opinion on the opponent's performance the last 5 seasons. This is relevant because, apparently, a lot of games are scheduled well in advance.

Nd's 2006 schedule:
GTech: 3
PSU: 3
Michigan: 5
MSU: 3
Purdue: 3
Stanford: 2
UCLA: 4
Navy: 1
North Carolina: 2
Air Force: 2
Army: 1
USC: 5
Average: 2.83

Michigan 2006
Vanderbilt: 1
Central Michigan: 1
Notre Dame: 5
Wisconsin: 4
Minnesota: 3
MSU: 3
PSU: 3
Iowa: 4
Northwestern: 2
Ball State: 1
Indiana: 1
OSU: 5
Average: 2.75

Notre Dame 2007:
GTech: 3
PSU: 3
Michigan: 5
MSU: 3
Purdue: 3
UCLA: 4
BC: 4
USC: 5
Navy: 1
Air Force: 2
Duke: 1
Stanford: 2
Average: 3.00

Michigan 2007:
Eastern Michigan: 1
Oregon: 4
Notre Dame: 5
PSU: 3
Northwestern: 2
Purdue: 3
Illinois: 1
Minnesota: 3
MSU: 3
Wisconsin: 4
OSU: 5
Average: 3.09

Now, we play within the auspices of a conference, while Nd does not. While we do generally play a harder non-conference schedule than most conference teams, our averages are comparable to Nd’s and most conference teams would have schedules at around 2.6-2.8 range. Now, if Nd is only slightly higher than that, do they deserve a guarantee? I would consider it if your average was around 3.5, but not at 3, where it’s close to us.

 

[HereComeTheIrish]

I actually don't have a problem with that. While it's true that each major conference does indeed produce a noteworthy BCS candidate an overwhelming majority of years, it's also true that a FSU (last year), or a Big East team takes away the position of another, more worthy team. For the record, the Big East should be shut out of the automatic BCS bid, in my opinion.

However, the conference guarentees apply to ALL CONFERENCE TEAMS. They are not geared towards one team, which is the case with Nd. By your logic, Navy, Army, Temple and other independents deserve this exception as well. In an overwhelming majority of years, you are always going to have strong teams in conference, meaning you ALWAYS play hard games every year. On the other hand, Nd has the luxury of cherrypicking teams that sound sexy (Stanford, Syracuse, UCLA after a good year, PSU after a good year), but are actually rebuilding for one season. This allows them to intentionally fluff the schedule to get the BCS guarentee.

It would be one thing if Nd was not nationally known, if they didn't have their games broadcast by one network, or if they were shut out of BCS games unfairly. Of course, we all know this is not the case. Nd is so hyped as it is, it's hard to imagine how they could be shut out of a BCS game if the guarentee clause wasn't there. If anything, it's easy to imagine why they don't belong.

A team's track record matters. Even if you plan it out yeras in advance, those teams are still going to have histories. In 2013, Michigan/Oklahoma/USC will probably be good, while Navy/BYU will probably be bad.

Let's try to come up with a system to assess the schedule. I think most team can be broken down into five tiers.

1-Exceptional. Always in the top 10 most years. Is perinnel contender almost every season. Strong tradition.

2-Good but not great. Always in top 25, but rarely in top 10 at end of year. Has solid record of 8 or more wins, but cannot defeat tier 1 teams on a consistent basis. Very hard time rising to the top in the conference (Examples include BC, Iowa, Oregon)

3-Average. Sometimes in top 25, always in bowl. Has record of 6 or more wins most of the time, but rarely defeats tier 1 teams and only sometimes defeats tier 2 teams. Inconsistent, unstable coaching at times. Hit or miss recruiting.

4-Below Average. Rarely in top 25, only sometimes in bowl. Sometimes has winning record, but always at bottom half of conference. Difficulty maintaining consistentcy, coaching instablity common, interest level low from institution and fans. Can never break through with recruiting.

5-Why the hell do you have a football program? Never in top 25 or bowl. Always a doormat for conference teams. Instability everywhere, from recruiting to coaching.

So, with that basis, let's assess your schedule for this year and next compared to ours. I will base my opinion on the opponent's performance the last 5 seasons. Some used to be good, while others used be bad but are now good.

Nd's 2006 schedule:
GTech: 3
PSU: 3
Michigan: 5
MSU: 3
Purdue: 3
Stanford: 2
UCLA: 4
Navy: 1
North Carolina: 2
Air Force: 2
Army: 1
USC: 5
Average: 2.83

Michigan 2006
Vanderbilt: 1
Central Michigan: 1
Notre Dame: 5
Wisconsin: 4
Minnesota: 3
MSU: 3
PSU: 3
Iowa: 4
Northwestern: 2
Ball State: 1
Indiana: 1
OSU: 5
Average: 2.75

Notre Dame 2007:
GTech: 3
PSU: 3
Michigan: 5
MSU: 3
Purdue: 3
UCLA: 4
BC: 4
USC: 5
Navy: 1
Air Force: 2
Duke: 1
Stanford: 2
Average: 3.00

Michigan 2007:
Eastern Michigan: 1
Oregon: 4
Notre Dame: 5
PSU: 3
Northwestern: 2
Purdue: 3
Illinois: 1
Minnesota: 3
MSU: 3
Wisconsin: 4
OSU: 5
Average: 3.09

Now, we play within the auspices of a conference, while Nd does not. While we do generally play a harder non-conference schedule than most conference teams, our averages are comparable to Nd’s and most conference teams would have schedules at around 2.6-2.8 range. Now, if Nd is only slightly higher than that, do they deserve a guarantee? I would consider it if your average was around 3.5, but not at 3, where it’s close to us.

Please go back and look at your analysis. You are either drunk or really in need of shock therapy.

Central Mich...Vandy...Illinois...Eastern Michigan...Duke...Navy...Indiana...Ball State..."1"
1-Exceptional. Always in the top 10 most years. Is perinnel contender almost every season. Strong tradition.

Skunkbears are dumb and tend to wander into traffic at times...but what the hell are you talking about?

 

[VictorsValiant]

Look at the revision. I just reversed the numbers. Had you been sharp, you would have realized that.

We're actually much more analytical than you emotional nuts.

 

[HereComeTheIrish]

Look at the revision. I just reversed the numbers. Had you been sharp, you would have realized that.

We're actually much more analytical than you emotional nuts.

Perhaps your analysis could be true of us "emotional nuts"...we are pretty high strung...With all that being said...A Notre Dame man wouldn't have made that mistake in the first place. Doesn't speak well of the Skunkbears now does it?!?

Screw the Integer

 

[VictorsValiant]

Maybe you'd like to comment on the analysis as opposed to hurling personal insults before you realize I just reversed the numbers?

Perhaps an arrogant "Notre Dame man" ought to rely on himself as opposed to disparaging others.