Ever wonder what players think of Coach Weis?

[Irish Envy]

SI: More than anything else, what does Charlie Weis expects from his players?

Samardzija: Charlie Weis expects to get back what he's given you. He gives you a $160,000 scholarship to Notre Dame -- and he expects you to earn that scholarship, whether that's being on the scout team or special teams or making big plays on offense on Saturdays.

It's quotes like this that lead me to believe that player absolutely love Coach Weis. They know what he expects of them, and that he'll support them in anything they want to do if they give him 100% on the football field.

Source: Sports Illustrated Q&A with Jeff Samardzija

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

It's quotes like this that lead me to believe that player absolutely love Coach Weis. They know what he expects of them, and that he'll support them in anything they want to do if they give him 100% on the football field.

Source: Sports Illustrated Q&A with Jeff Samardzija

Great quote, and I love Weis, but really...have you ever seen a player dumb enough to bad mouth a coach while the guy was still the coach?

Players had nothing but great things to say about Willingham while Willingham was still the coach

 

[Irish Envy]

Great quote, and I love Weis, but really...have you ever seen a player dumb enough to bad mouth a coach while the guy was still the coach?

Players had nothing but great things to say about Willingham while Willingham was still the coach

Yeah, many times. Also, I do believe there were several anonymous accounts of how lax Willingham was on players, in practice, etc.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

Yeah, many times. Also, I do believe there were several anonymous accounts of how lax Willingham was on players, in practice, etc.

I never saw a thing until after he was fired....

Tons of praise while he was there and tons of outrage when he was fired....

 

[Vince Young]

I never saw a thing until after he was fired....

Tons of praise while he was there and tons of outrage when he was fired....

Yeah, but players ALWAYS love a lax coach. That's why the Spoiled Children love One-Pete so much, and why the Gators bellyached so much when Ron Zook got fired.

There's only two ways a coach is going to be truly hated: if he's pointlessly sadistic, or if he's truly and utterly incompetent. Ty certainly wasn't elite by any means, but finishing over .500 with a handful of big wins over strong teams isn't exactly incompetent either. Combine that with his laidback attitude, and it's easy to see why our boys liked him.

But you don't make coaching decisions based on what the players think. Reminds me of what Gene Hackman said to Denzel Washington in "Crimson Tide":

"We are here to defend democracy, not practice it!"

 

[Dannyboy Ayers]

you don't have to like the coach or what he is teaching but you better respect him if you want to be on the feild. how often do you hear of players being released now for conduct detrimental to the team on the pro level of all sports and on the collegite level. most recently is the case of the Bluejays and Florida State. no player wants to be the guy who thinks he knows it better than the coach.

 

[tgolden]

I never heard anything about Willingham being lax on players before or after he was coach. There were a few comments about the system, but never anything about him being lax. I know there were some comments to that affect about Davie, but I never heard a single one about Willingham.

And believe it or not, it is possible for a coach to not be a tyrant and still be a good coach. It doesn't work in all cases, but it can work.

 

[tommy]

i really dont like the word tyrant save that for the mussalini stalin and hitlers of the world just because you demand a high leavel of integrity on and off the feild doesnt warrent a tyrant labeling thats whats wrong with the world everyone is worryed about niceitys parents have no control over there kids because if they try 2 diciplin there child the child knows he or she can call and make a false accusation about child abuse i know in some way it has 2 do with people that really have abused there child but dicipline and strictness isnt abuse

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

I never heard anything about Willingham being lax on players before or after he was coach. There were a few comments about the system, but never anything about him being lax. I know there were some comments to that affect about Davie, but I never heard a single one about Willingham.

And believe it or not, it is possible for a coach to not be a tyrant and still be a good coach. It doesn't work in all cases, but it can work.

Good post.

To be honest, all I ever heard about when Ty was around was "strong work ethic" and "discipline".

Clearly, discipline and team mentality were lacking...but I never heard about it until after he was fired.

That being said, I think it's pretty clear that Weis has guys practicing so hard they barf. He's NOT an easy coach...but he's a damn good one.

 

[tgolden]

i really dont like the word tyrant save that for the mussalini stalin and hitlers of the world just because you demand a high leavel of integrity on and off the feild doesnt warrent a tyrant labeling thats whats wrong with the world everyone is worryed about niceitys parents have no control over there kids because if they try 2 diciplin there child the child knows he or she can call and make a false accusation about child abuse i know in some way it has 2 do with people that really have abused there child but dicipline and strictness isnt abuse

ok, yeah, tyrant is a little strong... and I wasn't talking about Weis if that's what you thought. I was being sarcastic which I often do.

Just from my personal experience, some coaches are a little too into the tough stuff that they miss the big picture. I'm not saying that is the case with Weis at all. All I'm saying is that it is possible to have a Willingham demeanered coach and still be good. And as for the high level of integrity on and off the field, I'd say that applies to Willingham as well as Weis.

And I recall when Willingham first came in, players talking about how intense practices were compared to before. I really don't think that discipline/intensity was the problem. It was the system. But really what I'm trying to get down to is that I don't want this board to become a bash Willingham board every chance you get like some other ND boards have become.

Weis is a great coach. I'm glad we have him. I was not calling him a tyrant, so I hope it's all clear now.

 

[Óglaigh_na_hÉireann]

Well, you really don't need to even go into a diatribe against Tyrone Willingham. All you need to say is the magic word: incompetent.

That's all there is to it. The guy can't coach football and he will never be productive.

 

[tgolden]

here we go on this board too. He coaches football pretty well, and he has been productive. He's gone, we're not playing Washington this year, so how about we just leave the man in peace. Let's just leave it at that and not keep comparing what he did to the current situation.

 

[SuperBowlIVBaby]

I don't have nearly the problem with his coaching that I do with his recruiting. And yes, I know he was the one who brought in Jeff S, Zibby, and Brady. But, I think that was a fluke because the other 2 years were disasters and things were bound to only get worse. Not to mention what he has done at UW which "ain't" a whole lot to write home to Mom about. Respectable coach, HORRIBLE recruiter!

 

[irishwavend]

1.) Even when Ty was doing well that first year, we were all holding our breaths each game hoping that bubble wouldn't burst and that our Defense would always pull our non-existent offense out of the bind of producing no points...It burst at BC, so we always knew Ty was a piss poor offensive coach, especially when we lost to Syracuse the second year.

2.) Try not to lose too much respect for me, but I went to see the Devil Wears Prada, and I view Weis sorta like Meryl Streep in that movie...A real hardass, but one that you respect after you get over feeling sorry for yourself.

 

[rontdtarchala]

crystal...
I agree with all of you, but I do want a very disciplined coach at the helm that has the system in place that will take us to the promised land. so to speak...

 

[marv81s]

I for one as a ND fan am getting kinda bored with this whole Ty discussion. It was all over the message board on ESPN on the ND team page. I don't think he is a bad coach, but he isn't a great coach either, he is a good coach. Obviously he didn't get the most out of his players because look what Weis did with Ty's so-so recruits. I think ND wasn't a good fit for Ty and I gotta believe Ty was happy to get out of ND and all the preassure that comes with being a head coach for ND.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

My thoughts on Ty though not very popular...

The guy came in during a real rough patch and helped the program.

The big complaint was Notre Dame couldn't recruit Pro-Style players anymore, just big slow guys to run the ball. Ty came in and changed that around. This was not and is not an easy task.

He brought in Quinn....(you guys can cry Ndukwe did, ndukwe did, but Ndukwe doesn't have the ability to offer scholarships and its not like Quinn was a late pickup, ND had a verbal from him before the season even started), He brought in VERY talented WR's to fit a Pro-style offense, Etc etc etc...

The first year he changed the attitude around completely (like what Weis gets credit for now) and brought in a winning attitude....ND didn't have the horses to run the offense Ty Brought in......

Should he have addapted the offense...probably...but would we have gotten some of the players we did if he had?

His Second year...Yes he passed on Chris Olsen....(Has he even gotten a snap at UVA?)
We had a very young and inexperienced O-line....no real pro talent at WR that wasn't young...and TE's there were past QB's Holiday seemed like a good fit at first due to the weak o-line...we needed a QB that could move....but Holiday just couldn't pass and it became very clear that he wasn't going to get it down throwing the ball.

So Ty went with a True Freshman Brady Quinn....who got pummeled....there would be 4 guys hitting him every other play...the O-line just was to young and to inexperienced...so ND worked on experience.....

In his third year....the offense improved....no it didn't become a juggernaut, we still had a Sophomore QB, and Young Team around him....There was improvement but the team still wasn't clicking......The fact that ALL ELEVEN STARTERS were going to be coming back the next year, should tell you how young the team still was....

Lets also not forget that 2003 and 2004 were some of the tougher schedules ND has had in the last 20 years.....While 2005 was one of the easiest schedules ND has had in 20 years...

Yes there were some bad blowouts, yes, mabye he should have adjusted his offense more....but all that would have done was maybe give us another victory or 2 and make the blowouts more respectable.....How does that really help for the future...

By no means am I claiming Willingham was a great or even a good coach....but I wouldn't call him incompetent....I'd say he still has a lot to prove at this level, and he didn't get the job done at ND....but he did some positive things for this programs...while taking those big lumps (blowouts losses)...

His recruiting wasn't stupendous and maybe not even good....but again, don't forget he had a team full of underclassman so that means little playing time to offer freshman....on top of that the young team was losing .... so there goes the "excitement factor that helps with recruiting"...

If you look at the Program Willingham inherated and the progre Weis inheirated....Can you honestly say you would rather take over the program Willingham got....or the one we have now.....

Then....Power running style team....Few returning starters in your second year...a lot of underclassman...Very tough schedules....

Now...Pro-Style talent...experienced...Tons of returning starters both in your first AND second years on offense....Lots of playing time to offer recruits...and one of ND's easiest schedules in decades...


For these reason I have no annimosty towards Ty and often find myself defending him, I think Weis is a much better coach and am glad we lucked out in getting him (I did not want Meyer at all, though I think he is a good fit for Florida)

But all this hate for Ty shockes and even offends me at times....I think/hope a lot of it comes from the backlash ND took, and for those reasons ND fans want Ty to fail so they can tell the media....."See We told you he sucked", as for me I wish him luck...I hope he succeeds at UW but I'm not going to follow the program like the folks that hate him will.

He was a good man....Had a VERY difficult overhaull to do at ND...I think he did a decent job of it...think its a shame he didn't get a year with an experienced team he built...however I'm glad Weis is our coach.

 

[BigIrish]

By no means am I claiming Willingham was a great or even a good coach....but I wouldn't call him incompetent....I'd say he still has a lot to prove at this level, and he didn't get the job done at ND....but he did some positive things for this programs...while taking those big lumps (blowouts losses)...

And therein lies the difference. When Weis leaves Notre Dame, he will raised the standard back to where it should be. Coaches don't come to Notre Dame to "prove themselves at this level" while "taking their lumps" along the way. Go to the MAC or Mountain West to do that. But when you come to the Irish, you better have demonstrated the fact that you're capable of taking over one of the premier coaching jobs in the country.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

And therein lies the difference. When Weis leaves Notre Dame, he will raised the standard back to where it should be. Coaches don't come to Notre Dame to "prove themselves at this level" while "taking their lumps" along the way. Go to the MAC or Mountain West to do that. But when you come to the Irish, you better have demonstrated the fact that you're capable of taking over one of the premier coaching jobs in the country.

That is great rhetoric and all, but the reality is, Weis walked into a Pretty damn good situation, Willingham walked into a HUGE overhaul project.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

BTW, if people want to say Willingham hurt the Defense, I have no problem with that and Agree...problem is, most Willingham haters don't talk about the D much because the D's numbers actually got worst last year under Weis

 

[BigIrish]

That is great rhetoric and all, but the reality is, Weis walked into a Pretty damn good situation, Willingham walked into a HUGE overhaul project.

rhetoric? ok. you win. everybody here knows you're a ty guy. nobody here is looking to get sucked into your cause again. good luck with the campaign, though.

 

[irishwavend]

That is great rhetoric and all, but the reality is, Weis walked into a Pretty damn good situation, Willingham walked into a HUGE overhaul project.

Actually, Ty walked into a better situation. You guys may forget, but while Davie was a crappy coach, he was a great recruiter. We always had tons of talent under him, he just squandered it all. Willingham had quite a bit of talent to work with. We skyrocketed into the Top 5 that one year because Ty was going undefeated and there was excitement about the new coach, but that was only one year's class. The other two classes were beyond piss poor and he didn't even use all of the scholarships. Weis is walking in with one class that has great players, but with nobody else to fill in for those players. Also, Ty is an awful coach...Instead of teaching guys to read the defense and read what their moves are after the snap, Ty showed his guys how to wait and watch for the receivers to get open. The Defense his first year was all Davie guys who, it could be argued, were still riding Davie's coaching, b/c you notice that there was a significant drop off the next year. Ty also had a knack for making the wrong halftime adjustments. How many times did you notice us coming out of the locker room and either doing the same stuff, so the other team could pick us apart, or we would actually make an adjustment away from something that worked, and we would get burnt. The Huskies will be ecstatic when Ty leaves...give it a year. Actually, can we put that on the Sports Book...betting on when Ty gets the can at Washington?

 

[tgolden]

For these reason I have no annimosty towards Ty and often find myself defending him, I think Weis is a much better coach and am glad we lucked out in getting him (I did not want Meyer at all, though I think he is a good fit for Florida)

But all this hate for Ty shockes and even offends me at times....I think/hope a lot of it comes from the backlash ND took, and for those reasons ND fans want Ty to fail so they can tell the media....."See We told you he sucked", as for me I wish him luck...I hope he succeeds at UW but I'm not going to follow the program like the folks that hate him will.

He was a good man....Had a VERY difficult overhaull to do at ND...I think he did a decent job of it...think its a shame he didn't get a year with an experienced team he built...however I'm glad Weis is our coach.

These are almost my exact feelings. It seems like if anyone defends him, they are attacked mercilessly and treated as if they aren't a true ND fan which is a shame. And he still brought us Brady, Tommy, Jeff, Darius (after a bad season), Rhema, all those guys that played huge roles last year and will again this year. I hope he does well with Washington. But that's it, he's with Washington.

That said, Go Irish!

 

[scooper]

I have no problem with people defending certain aspects of Ty's tenure. In some accounts, he was an improvement over Davie. In some, he was worse. I don't hate the man and I have no problems if some people want to look back fondly on him.

But some people want to stir the pot. And everytime something nice is written about Charlie, they start spewing their "Ty's recruits! Ty's recruits!" mantra. His supposed recruiting acumen has been shot down time and time again.

Another mantra is his first year compared to Charlie's. Opposing fans really love this one. That is an argument for people who refuse to look below the surface. This year's team played harder, smarter and longer than the 02 ever did. This team never got blown out or fell apart when behind. Quite the opposite, really. When they got behind, they battled back. On paper the two teams were similar. Hard to argue. On the field, there was no comparison. I also don't buy that CW's situation was much better Though I will grant the offensive talent was there, that same talent was in the bottom half of the NCAA a year before. That kind of improvement can't be explained away simply by one year of experience, especially considering the offense did not improve the year before over the course of the season. It was NOT all about experience.

As for their situations, the experience level of CW's offense matches the level of the defense that Ty had the luxury of in his first year. There were also some very strong returning special teams. Ty wasn't handed a pile of garbage to work with.

Now, I don't even have a problem with people who want to wait and see on Charlie. That's certainly a fair assesment. We've been burned before and one year certainly doesn't mean much. However, caution with him has NOTHING to do with Willingham or your defense of him. They are different coaches. Their situations are different. Most feel we are in better shape now. If you don't agree or want to wait and see, fine. That's your perogative. But to try to bring the rest of us down with the credit to Ty mantra is getting tired and is just wrong. Every new coach starts with the old coach's players.

 

[jiggafini19]

BACK TO THE TOPIC OF THE THREAD IF I MAY

I seriously doubt Charlie Weis is there to be anyone's friend. Coach, yes. Friend, probably not.

Samardzija isn't dumb. All that quote said to me, in college football player speak, is "Coach Weis is a ballbuster and a hard ass." He just says it in a very nice way. The straight forward, honest, no holds barred, make you earn everything kind of description of Weis makes me think that he's not exactly a warm and fuzzy man when it comes to his football. It is his job. He wants to do it well and takes it seriously.

I doubt he sugarcoats much or pussyfoots around with anyone whether it is Brady Quinn, Jeff Samardzija or a walk on.

Now if this were Dwayne Jarrett, it would have been "Coach Carroll is my friend. And practice is oh, so much fun. I love practice. Coach Carroll designs practices for our enjoyment. And when Coach Norton barks at us like he's a dog? Well, I feel warm inside."

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

Scooper, I think you can expect a pretty big improvement in an offense when you return 11 starters including a JR Quarterback going into his 3rd year as a starter. Especially if you knew going into the season you were about to play one of the easiest schedules ND has faced in 2 decades.

No question the offense played better under one of the NFL's best offensive Cordinators...however to say they wouldn't have improved IMO is stretching it a bit.

 

[DeeRock]

Time Will Tell- The Man Only Coached One Season, And You Are Already Placing Him On Rockne's Level- That Is Absurd!

 

[DeeRock]

Ty's Recruits!

 

[scooper]

I didn't say they wouldn't improve. But to the extent that they did improve, no. I don't think so.

Case in point-I expect the defense, which returns almost everybody, to improve this year based on a year of conditioning, maturity and experience. However, I don't expect them to improve to the point of top 10 in the country like the offense did. I see them going from poor to average at best in one year.

Thankfully, with our offense, an average defense can go a long way. With a good defense, they'd darn near unstoppable.

I'm not going to fight this fight with you, though. You are a Ty guy, as has been stated above. Your loyalty to him is fine. It doesn't bother me. Nor should it bother you when some fans don't think too highly of his abilities as a coach.

We're not going to change your mind. You're not going to change ours. We're happy with the coach at Notre Dame. You're more than welcome to continue to make this about the coach at Washington. Though don't be surprised if the rest of us don't give him the credit you do.

 

[scooper]

Time Will Tell- The Man Only Coached One Season, And You Are Already Placing Him On Rockne's Level- That Is Absurd!

Nobody has put him on Rockne's level. To twist any praise for him into us putting him on Rock's level is truly absurd.

If you come here to flame, at least state your loyalty.