[October 15, 2005] #1 USC (5-0) at #9 Notre Dame (4-1)

[LouHoltz09]

ND got F'ed. The spot was wrong, and they clearly attempted to call a timeout they didnt have which of course is a penalty. They should have been kicking a fg for OT. I just cant believe we got duped. I was screaming from my couch begging for a time out. Jesus Christ, of course they aint downing the God damn ball - the clock was already stopped. How USC had the presence of mind during all that clusterF of pandemonium to get together to know they would fake that and run the play is amazing - give them credit. However, as stated, they never should have had the chance as the ball was misspotted and timeout was attempted by USC player. Unreal.

 

[KMac151993]

"That's not allowed in many parts of Utah!"

LOL

What was that!??????

 

[BGIF]

What was that!??????

One of the Southern Cal players was laying on the sideline on his back while a trainer was leaning over him bending one of his legs back toward his ears, spreading his legs like scissors and the announcer quipped, "that's illegal in parts of Utah".

It was subtle and the camera quickly moved back to the field. It was missed by most watchers. Adult humor but inappropriate in a PC world. That's probably why I chortled.

 

[irish9331]

Ambrose Wooten covered no one all day!!!!!!!!!

Sorry sir, he had great coverage on that play. USC just made a play.

 

[BGIF]

It was an ending that will go down in lore. Famous in LA; infamous in South Bend.

I don't know about the spot. Some of you guys say the 2 or the 3. I thought the ball shot over the pylon which would have been a touchdown. One of the announcers commented that one ref signaled TOUCHDOWN. Perhaps a anticapated result but if he was signaling the ball crossed the goalline and then rule fumble it's a turnover.

I'm not certain on the rules on calling an illegal timeout. It does matter what the coaches signal. Time outs are signaled by players on the field. I though years ago there was a penalty for calling an illegal timeout at the least it's delay of game. Since the ball was ruled (rightfully or wrongfully) out of bounds, time stops, and the "illegal" call takes place AFTER THE PLAY and time is out already hence there is not delay.

Now one thing I noticed that the post game announcers highlighted was Reggie Bush applying forward pressure to Leinart for the second effort that got him in the endzone. "Helping the runner" is a penalty although rarely called. Usually it happens when another player(s) put his shoulder behind the ball carrier and push forward like he's blocking. Watch the click, Bush doesn't try to "throw a block" he puts his palms on Leinart and pushes him into the enzone. Unless that rule is no longer on the books, that was blatant helping the runner. Leinart's foward progress was stopped until Bush assisted the runner.

Althought there was no "instant replay" for this game I found it curious that NBC didn't run multiple camera angles of the 1 yd out of bounds play. That wasn't Haden's decision. The producer makes those calls and I think there was pressure from higher up in NBC to break to NASCAR which had already started. Normally we would have seen multiple angles of the play. So much for The Notre Dame Network.

 

[BGIF]

Sorry sir, he had great coverage on that play. USC just made a play.

I agree with that. USC nailed one but Wooden made an incredible recovery to run him down.

Somebody, I think Svoboda made a comment to the effect, "that's the difference between a good CB and a great one". I doubt there is anyone on this board that 6 weeks ago would have put Wooden in the "good CB" category. Wooden is still developing but he's come a long way. Richardson also made plays today that I didn't think him capable of.

 

[BGIF]

Note Bush's outstretched palms after pushing Leinart's upper body over the goal line.

 

[Vince Young]

I'm sorry, have I wandered into the Michigan forums by mistake?

Guys. We lost. We could've stopped them back on 4th and 9, and instead we gave them the opportunity to win.

Victory was within our grasp on several other occasions in the 4th quarter, and we just didn't grab it. I'm not putting this one on the refs. This one's on our defense for not stopping USC, and this one's on our offense for not scoring enough points to put the game away.

 

[PantsB]

I don't know about the spot. Some of you guys say the 2 or the 3. I thought the ball shot over the pylon which would have been a touchdown.

I think this should be touchback (big difference lol).

Question: If an offensive player fumbles just before crossing the defender's goal line and the ball goes out of bounds through the back of the end zone, who gets possession, and where is the ball put back into play? What if the ball was knocked out of the runner's hands?

Answer: NCAA: Force/impetus is always attributed to the player that fumbles, regardless of how the ball was knocked out. Simply touching the fumble does not change the original force/impetus.
If a fumble goes forward into and out of the opponents' endzone, it is a touchback for the opponents. 1st and 10 from the 20 yardline.

Source

 

[KMac151993]

Sitting here and complaining about the call is not going to change the outcome, the kids played their hearts out and lost, but they never gave up and fought till the bitter end, so what if USC got the breaks and got favorable calls down the stretch, we still lost; but this team has come leaps and bounds from last year (the past 3 years) defeat at the hands of USC. Those games were laughable this game came down to the final couple of minutes. I think if anyone had said we would have the lead on USC in the final minute of the game back in Jan. that person would have been deamed crazy. Weis has turned this thing around and has done it very quickly. A 10-2 season is not out of the realm of possibilites with this squad, just wait till Weis has "his" players, it maybe just a few years before we deam a 10-2 season "average" or subpar". Congrats so far to the 2005 Squad! GO IRISH BEAT COUGAR!

 

[guff]

I had an uncle who used to say "Put an excuse in one hand, a pile of sh*t in the other and tell me which one has more weight".

 

[BGIF]

I think this should be touchback

Thanks Pants, I meant touchback (my error), a fumble through the endzone, ND ball.

 

[Aerosmith777]

And Mark May's anti-ND bias continues. Now he's going on and on about how ND hasn't beaten a team w/ a winning record yet this season (which isn't even true, last I checked Michigan is 4-3, but don't let the facts get in the way of your analysis Mark). When asked if ND would lose again, May said they would and that Tennessee was gonna be a really tough game.

Holtz had a great line though, he goes, "You need to get on "What's My Line?" because no one's gonna believe you're an analyst after that statement."

 

[notredame213]

Its good to see Holtz sticking up for the Irish and putting that idiot Mark May in his place. Sometimes i wonder what goes through that guy's head. all he talked about today on the pregame show was how much notre dame would be routed by SC. This guy needs to get a clue and stop bashing ND just because he's jealous that his Pitt team is terrible

 

[Vince Young]

On the one hand, Mark May's "half-a-hundred" prediction failed. (And for the record, I defended Mark May on that one... remember, Michigan State came close to hanging half-a-hundred on us.)

On the other hand, the best team we've beaten this year is a 4-3 Michigan squad.

The guy's got a point. You can quibble with Mark May over the phrase "winning record," or you can look at the overall point he's making, which is that Notre Dame has yet to beat a quality opponent this year. We've come close twice, but close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

I think we'll beat Tennessee. I also happen to believe Tennessee is grossly overrated this year, which kinda puts us right back where we started: Notre Dame has yet to beat a quality opponent this year, and probably won't get the chance to until we go bowling.

But we're making progress from last year. That's all I wanted to see for C-Dub's first year, and so far, that's what I see.

 

[irish9331]

Because I had to work overnight tonight, I have had to think about this game for the last few hours, and I am still upset about it. Being a Packer fan I am still haunted by the 4th and 26, now I have 4th and 9 to deal with, man someone pass the bottle. As far as May is concerned, he is going to be bitter, and continue to talk trash. He needs to be that way to justify his stance that racism is what contributed to Losingham's firing, just curious Mark, how is Washington doing. The comment that Notre Dame hasn't beaten anyone with a winning record is also very weak. Wasn't this the same guy who along with Corso was sure that Notre Dame would be 1-5 or 0-6 after this week because of how difficult the schedule was. Sorry that our boys have been working to improve and not continuing the mediocrity that was beginning under Willingham. If Ty was the coach do they take the ball down the field with 5 minutes left, probably not. They run 3 bubble screens and have to punt. This is the new era people. If Walls and the other recruits for the secondary are everything that is advertised, and Brady doesn't feel that he is ready to move on to the NFL, there is no ceiling for this team. Remember the schedule gets a little bit easier next year, games with North Carolina, and Army. Brady will be a Heisman front runner if he comes back. This is what we are ND fans for. This is the excellence that we have been lacking since '93. Sorry for rambling folks but had to get it out. Here no-one here really cares about ND losing, they still can't get over Minnesota blowing up at the end of that game.

 

[Aerosmith777]

On the other hand, the best team we've beaten this year is a 4-3 Michigan squad.

The guy's got a point. You can quibble with Mark May over the phrase "winning record," or you can look at the overall point he's making, which is that Notre Dame has yet to beat a quality opponent this year. We've come close twice, but close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

I think we'll beat Tennessee. I also happen to believe Tennessee is grossly overrated this year, which kinda puts us right back where we started: Notre Dame has yet to beat a quality opponent this year, and probably won't get the chance to until we go bowling.

Gotta disagree w/ you. I know Michigan's not Michigan this year, but wins in Ann Arbour, especially early in the season when they're ranked in the top 3, still count for something in my book. And don't forget, ND hasn't just won their other 3 games, they've kicked the crap out of Pitt at Pitt, Washington (no big deal there) and Purdue at Purdue. I know none of those teams are having great seasons, but to not only beat them (especially Pitt & Purdue) but to totally just lay the smack down on them in their own buildings still counts for something I think.

I also think ND will beat Tennessee, if and when they do I'm sure Mark May will be harping on how Tennessee's over-rated too. That's kinda the point I guess. The guy just adamently refuses to give ND credit for anything. Before the season if you had told Mark May that ND would be 4-2 through its first 6 games and would go toe-to-toe w/ USC for 60 minutes (well, 59 minutes and 53 seconds anyway) he'd of laughed at you. The fact is, HE should be the one that looks like an idiot given his predictions early in the year, but he just refuses to admit that. At least Corso has admitted he was wrong and that the Irish are much better than he expected them to be. May is too arrogant for that though.

I dunno, I had a point in there somewhere that got lost in the rambling, I just really hate that guy...he's so unprofessional I think...

 

[Vince Young]

I dunno, I had a point in there somewhere that got lost in the rambling, I just really hate that guy...he's so unprofessional I think...

Well, I agree there. Mark May is a prick. It's just that I make it a point not to disagree with a person solely because they're a prick. Pricks can be right too.

You make a good point about the blowout wins, and winning in the Big House is never quite "easy." But Michigan's ranking at-the-time doesn't really matter, because we now know they were way-overrated at-the-time. And I'll always be more impressed by a close win over a great team than by a blowout win over a weak team.

Mark May, prick that he is, still makes a valid point: the best record we've beaten this year is 4-3, Michigan's record. That's worth considering.

 

[KMac151993]

Yes but at the same instance, if you dont beat those teams, they would have better records and play better down the stretch. For example: Pitt is 3-3 without a loss to us and Michigan would be 4-2 excluding our game. I think Purdue pulls it out against Northwestern yesterday if they beat us. A win is a win no matter who it is or what they are ranked or what their final record is. Yesterday showed that we are a legit Top 10 team.

 

[Aerosmith777]

I think Purdue pulls it out against Northwestern yesterday if they beat us.

I agree w/ that as well. I think taking a bad loss like we gave Purdue or Michigan, especially when their expectations are still relatively high, can really kill a team's season and make it start to unravel. For those of you like me in the New York area, Mike Francessa was talkin about this the other day in reference to Michigan. His point was that loss to the Irish was the kinda loss that makes a team w/ huge expectations like Michigan's season unravel. I really think that could be the case, which is why I think that win is still pretty impressive despite Michigan's season since. And the win they had yesterday is the kinda win that could compel them to run the table and go 8-3, in which case the Irish win over them will look better.

 

[Vince Young]

That's true as well. Think about last year if we'd beaten BYU in the opener... hell, Ty might still be coach!