Tom Zbikowski Made Some Great Points About ND Football

[I Dont Miss Charlie]

Lou retired because there was no way that the Administration was going to allow him to stay and pass up Rockne on the All Time Win list.

They also weren't going to allow him to potentially do it with Jucos and guys that shouldn't even be at Notre Dame, like Randy Moss.

 

[Gipper]

They also weren't going to allow him to potentially do it with Jucos and guys that shouldn't even be at Notre Dame, like Randy Moss.

Have to agree with you there ChamPEN.

 

[tankjeep]

The fact that we've had minimal success with our current starters, yet none of the freshmen in these successful recruiting classes can come in and start or even get playing time says a lot. The top teams in the country are able to yearly recruit as well as Notre Dame but they can plug their freshmen in yearly and be successful. You do realize a Notre Dame offer propels a players ranking, yet a Notre Dame commitment almost always drops their ranking. Its kinda funny how that works.

i don't know about the ranking dropping or going up, but those tops programs get jucos. nd doesn't. it's the jucos that make it easier to develop young freshman talent. jucos are what bridge the gap and get plugged in to be successful.

then those freshman are groomed and eventually get worked into the mix. nd's only bridge for that gap is continued recruiting to fill holes in depth and each class that steps up in rank is where the success is supposed to come from.

and as far as freshman not coming in and starting, what about t'eo? micheal floyd? sam young? kyle rudolph? robert blanton?

 

[I Dont Miss Charlie]

Have to agree with you there ChamPEN.

Its kinda funny how he left and was able to do exactly what he wanted with his team at South Carolina, and then his career ended with a huge brawl on the field by his team of Jucos and guys with questionable character.

 

[Gipper]

Its kinda funny how he left and was able to do exactly what he wanted with his team at South Carolina, and then his career ended with a huge brawl on the field by his team of Jucos and guys with questionable character.

I know but you can't refute the fact that he went to a Bowl game in no later than his second season at every school he coached. And that was done taking over at losing programs, not walking into championship contenders. He also won a National Championship for my beloved Irish so I gotta love the guy.

 

[I Dont Miss Charlie]

i don't know about the ranking dropping or going up, but those tops programs get jucos. nd doesn't. it's the jucos that make it easier to develop young freshman talent. jucos are what bridge the gap and get plugged in to be successful.

Thats 100% false.
USC has 1 Juco on their roster, and he doesnt even start.
Florida has 2 Jucos on their roster, and neither of them start or play.
Alabama has 4 Jucos on their roster, and only Cody starts.
Texas doesn't even have a Juco on their roster.

What is your excuse?

then those freshman are groomed and eventually get worked into the mix. nd's only bridge for that gap is continued recruiting to fill holes in depth and each class that steps up in rank is where the success is supposed to come from.

The same can be said at each of the schools I mentioned, their freshman come in immediately and make an impact. They become sophmores and the next batch of freshman come in and make an impact. Its a revolving door that keeps these programs afloat, but has sunk Notre Dame.

Whats the problem if we're getting top talent ranked on par with all of the schools mentioned above?

and as far as freshman not coming in and starting, what about t'eo? micheal floyd? sam young? kyle rudolph? robert blanton?

I never said freshmen don't come in and start but we can't plug all of these guys in yearly. With the next coach I want to see an emphasis on giving freshman an equal opportunity to earn playing time.

We redshirted a 5* RB, and have 2 of the top Wideouts in the class of 2009 not getting any playing time.

 

[I Dont Miss Charlie]

I know but you can't refute the fact that he went to a Bowl game in no later than his second season at every school he coached. And that was done taking over at losing programs, not walking into championship contenders. He also won a National Championship for my beloved Irish so I gotta love the guy.

He definetly deserves credit, he only wants to do whats best for the team and he gave opportunities to a lot of young kids and pleaded for an opportunity for others.

He left because he knew that the landscape was changing and without Notre Dame giving him some of things needed to survive the change that we wouldn't progress as a program. Unfortunately, he hasn't been proven wrong yet.

 

[WaveDomer]

He definetly deserves credit, he only wants to do whats best for the team and he gave opportunities to a lot of young kids and pleaded for an opportunity for others.

He left because he knew that the landscape was changing and without Notre Dame giving him some of things needed to survive the change that we wouldn't progress as a program. Unfortunately, he hasn't been proven wrong yet.

Unfortunately, there's been a lot of smoke everywhere Lou has coached. I think this had something to do with him leaving. He's had infractions following him.

 

[I Dont Miss Charlie]

Unfortunately, there's been a lot of smoke everywhere Lou has coached. I think this had something to do with him leaving. He's had infractions following him.

That also. He gets out before anything damages his reputation.

 

[NDMontana]

What are you rambling on about now? ND Stadium is in excellent condition. It was renovated in 1997 and brought up to good working order.

QUOTE]

you are confused. how could you have possibly gleaned from my comments anything relating the stadium being in desrepair or in poor condition. i know it was renovated. i practically live next door to it.

grab yourself a dictionary:

antiseptic: definition-completely clean, uncontaminated;

that was the point. it is very clean and has a clinical feel to it, but is devoid of any interesting characteristics, which could be said of many stadiums. the history is what makes it special. i could only name a handful of stadiums that are really unique (structurally speaking). there is just so much an architect can do to a football stadium.

I shouldn't be posting at the time of night. I did a poor job of reading, no need for a dictionary. I just scanned your post and saw the word septic.

 

[dskoo65]

I shouldn't be posting at the time of night. I did a poor job of reading, no need for a dictionary. I just scanned your post and saw the word septic.

no sweat. i didnt do a great job articulating what i was trying to say anyway.

 

[tankjeep]

Thats 100% false.
USC has 1 Juco on their roster, and he doesnt even start.
Florida has 2 Jucos on their roster, and neither of them start or play.
Alabama has 4 Jucos on their roster, and only Cody starts.
Texas doesn't even have a Juco on their roster.

What is your excuse?


The same can be said at each of the schools I mentioned, their freshman come in immediately and make an impact. They become sophmores and the next batch of freshman come in and make an impact. Its a revolving door that keeps these programs afloat, but has sunk Notre Dame.

Whats the problem if we're getting top talent ranked on par with all of the schools mentioned above?



I never said freshmen don't come in and start but we can't plug all of these guys in yearly. With the next coach I want to see an emphasis on giving freshman an equal opportunity to earn playing time.

We redshirted a 5* RB, and have 2 of the top Wideouts in the class of 2009 not getting any playing time.

am i supposed to take your word for it?

just becuz you say it, it must be the truth?

plus, out of those schools you mentioned, how many freshman actually start?

i guess i need to do some research then just to figure this crap out. but at least i'll admit if i'm wrong, but even if i was right (and that could be a stretch i know) i'm not one to be a prick about it.....like some people here.

 

[tankjeep]

am i supposed to take your word for it?

just becuz you say it, it must be the truth?

plus, out of those schools you mentioned, how many freshman actually start?

i guess i need to do some research then just to figure this crap out. but at least i'll admit if i'm wrong, but even if i was right (and that could be a stretch i know) i'm not one to be a prick about it.....like some people here.

just for my sake and to get this off my chest.....

okay, i didn't go online and look at every other roster to check for jucos.....to me it would've been pointless and i have much more of a life than that. anyway....

champen you may very well be right about the number of jucos on those respective teams, but you cannot dispell the fact that a majority of successful football programs do take advantage of using jucos to fill holes.

with that being said, the current crop of jucos you so eloquently pointed out (which happens to be a small number) doesn't really make your point. what about the past? how many did they use to fill holes? i don't know that number nor do i care to find out, but i'm pretty sure that jucos have been used to establish an early foundation in a program, then the recruiting and coaching did the rest to keep the success on track.

my point, is that notre dame hasn't had the luxury of doing that. so with bob & ty and their less than stellar recruiting (supposedly, again i don't know for fact but what i've read and heard) it set notre dame back a few years as far as bringing the recruits for solid foundation for a successful program. without jucos to band aid the program so it could get back on it's feet......losing & struggling was inevitable.

so, there.....pick it apart and be a prick all you want, champen. i've now since put you on the ignore list just to keep my blood pressure down. if i ever overstep my bounds i apologize and make amends, but rarely do i jump on another poster for their respective ideas/discussions or whatever.

 

[I Dont Miss Charlie]

just for my sake and to get this off my chest.....

okay, i didn't go online and look at every other roster to check for jucos.....to me it would've been pointless and i have much more of a life than that. anyway....

champen you may very well be right about the number of jucos on those respective teams, but you cannot dispell the fact that a majority of successful football programs do take advantage of using jucos to fill holes.

with that being said, the current crop of jucos you so eloquently pointed out (which happens to be a small number) doesn't really make your point. what about the past? how many did they use to fill holes? i don't know that number nor do i care to find out, but i'm pretty sure that jucos have been used to establish an early foundation in a program, then the recruiting and coaching did the rest to keep the success on track.

my point, is that notre dame hasn't had the luxury of doing that. so with bob & ty and their less than stellar recruiting (supposedly, again i don't know for fact but what i've read and heard) it set notre dame back a few years as far as bringing the recruits for solid foundation for a successful program. without jucos to band aid the program so it could get back on it's feet......losing & struggling was inevitable.

so, there.....pick it apart and be a prick all you want, champen. i've now since put you on the ignore list just to keep my blood pressure down. if i ever overstep my bounds i apologize and make amends, but rarely do i jump on another poster for their respective ideas/discussions or whatever.

What the heck are you upset about?

I did nothing but point out that your opinion regarding Jucos being crucial to being a top team is not accurate, I pointed out that other schools have done a better job with plugging freshmen into their lineups than Notre Dame and have done it yearly. It has nothing to do with fielding Jucos to be a band aid, if a team can't reload yearly rather than rebuild then there is a serious problem just like its been here. A lot of the time a team fills their roster with Jucos as a band aid when a new regime has taken over for a failed regime, and there isn't much talent on the team to begin with. For example: Auburn, Tennessee, Mississippi State


I just dont think you can sit back and blame Davie and Ty for their less than stellar recruiting in terms of player ratings when we still dealt with the same issues regarding our team's readyness yearly under Charlie despite his top rated recruiting classes. Maybe, just maybe its tougher for some kids today to give a 150% effort in the classroom and then give a 150% effort on the football field.

I'm not jumping down your throat. It was for the sake of argument, you present your opinion, I counter, you counter, its all fair & friendly discussion. The post I am quoting seems like you got offended that I corrected you, now you're upset and are ignoring me because you don't want it to happen again. I have no problem with you at all.