Jimmy Clausen. King of the Chuck it up and pray.

[NDinL.A.]

A couple of you guys are unbelievable. Jimmy Clausen has an NFL arm; how you can't see the zip on his throws is beyond me. He had a Junior College line in front of him last year, and this year isn't a whole lot better. When he torches teams later this year and the next two years with those stud (YOUNG) wide receivers, I HOPE you come back here ready to eat crow. It's not his fault Kumara can't catch, and when he does catch stronger players rip the ball from him. He needs to read defenses better, I agree. But HE'S A SOPHOMORE PLAYING BEHIND A BELOW AVERAGE LINE.

The team is getting better, as there were a lot of postives today. Of course, yahoos who don't know a thing about football were predicting 11 wins for a team coming off 3 wins, so they're upset. The fact that someone would call for Crist already when we have a QB with an NFL future already playing, well, that shows me what they know about football. You really want to burn his 'redshirt' year because Kumara can't catch and Clausen had a couple poor throws? Ummm, wow.

You talk about USC, let's talk about their QB's. Leinart: redshirt, didn't play until his 3rd year of college. Booty: redshirt, didn't play until his 4th year of college. Sanchez: redshirt, didn't win job until his 3rd year of college. Carson Palmer was a joke until late in his junior year, after having played since he was a junior. He was a ProBowler pre-injury. Clausen had to jump in as a freshman, and we're already calling for Crist who can't even beat out a baseball player, or we're saying we're 'stuck' with Clausen the next 3 years? Please!

Today's game ruined my day. But after reflection, we're getting better. There were tond of psitives. The score was much closer than it looked. So go ahead and yell 'fire weis', and 'clausen sucks'. Fine. I didn't see you on here after the Michigan game saying those things, but fine. Just please come back on after we're 8-4 this year w/ a bowl win, and 10-2 next year, and contenders in 2 years. I'll be here, supporting this team that is coming up...

 

[NDMontana]

You need to finish reading. I said I wanted to see Crist play here and there. Clausen is a future NFL QB? He has a hitch in his throwing motion, he doesn't have much of an arm, he telegraphs his passes and has shown no mobility at all. I haven't once said Clausen sucks or fire Weis. I don't think Clausen sucks, I think he's average. I don't want Weis fired, I want him to start developing talent and I want him to revamp the offense because, as stated by Michigan's players last season, it's pretty easy to read and stop.

We all suffered through a 3-9 season last year but we're still here, right? I love ND, too. That means blind devotion; you'll never see me wear any other logo on my hats or shirts. I'm loyal to the jersey and the school, not the players, I'm not going to start singing the praises of an average quarterback and a coach who has a whole lot to prove. I never thought that the ND fanbase would start looking for the silver lining in losses; there is no silver lining. We couldn't have blown a great high school defensive line off the ball. We gave up 200 yards rushing and had 16 yards rushing ourselves.

Our offense is ranked 100th, is that progress? JC's TD:INT ratio is 1:1, is that progress? We gave up 200 yards rushing today, progress?

It's hard to accept that we're going to be awful for 2 years and then good (not great) for 2 years from here on. But we don't look like we have the ability or the coaching to reload as opposed to rebuild. Don't get down on the team....just be realistic.

P.S. Nothing, and I mean nothing, would please me more than having to eat crow on the subject.

 

[renesikaffynd]

you guys are ignorant and impacient

you guys are ignorant and impacient

How can you compare jimmy clausen,,, better how could you compare this notredame team to georgia and matthew stafford or tim tebow

Matthew stafford and tebow clearly performed better because of who they played with.

georgia has been recruiting at a top 5 level for 6 years now, thats a lot more time compared to 2 years by ND leave alone florida... the have been recruiting like this for 8 years now.

you cannot compare the level of talent sorrounding this three different quarterbacks when they came in

tebow had louis murphy, percy harvin, baker, brandon james, an ofensive line with three
5-stars and five 4-stars, all of which can come in and contribute whenever.
florida boasts a boatload of 5-star proven guys at defense such as will hill, brandon spikes, and probably 8-12 more that make this defense a top 10 defense every year despite playing great teams. SEC

Matthew stafford had knowshon moreno, mohammed massaqua, an offensive line with two 5-star seniors and four 4-star junior and seniors, a defense again boasting top 5-star and 4-star players that were not freshmen or sophomores by the way. they also had deangelo tyson, curran, and the other young all american linebacker dont know his name.

my point is that even though tebow and stafford are good, maybe even great especially tebow.... they would not be nearly as good if the supporting cast was not elite as it is.
if you look at what nd has its not even worth to compare. nd has basically freshmen and sophomores as the core of their team, with david bruton, mcneil, macarthy and kuntz filling it up. lets face it,, crum sucks, he is a decent linebacker at best with very limited athletic ability.

another key piont to note is that weis s first recruiting class was pretty much almost totally overrated and or diminished. the offensive linemen from this class were all busts,, and yes including sam young wich was a 5 star but is performing like a 3 star. , eric olsen and wenger are busts. konrad reuland, carufel, jones, frazer left. while jackson, leonard gordon, gaines, toryan smith, and aldridge turned out to be busts as well,, ohh yes,, lets not forget about justin brown and morrice richardson, busts. the only productive players from this class are parris- decent, darrin walls - proven commodity, mcneil- good, gray - good and kyle macarthy very good.

you can see how overrated most of this class was when you compare its best players to this years class best players... sam young is decent at best while trevor robinson is already almost starting, justin brown and kallen wade have been aroung for 3 years but were passed by ethan johnson on the depth chart. it only goes on and on. this junior class was rated in the top-20 but didnt even deserve to be in the top-30

but, there is good news though, remember that the best player on the team -darrin walls and the future all american tight end are out, if they were playing we would have, better blocking at tight end for thr rbs and also we would not have to be so worried about man coverage if walls were there.

next years team is gonna be great

qb - clausen - crist
rb - allen - hughes
fb - luke schmidt
wr - golden tate - duval kamara
wr - michael floyd - deion walker
te - mike ragone - rudolph
o-line - sam young - trevor robinson, chris stewart, eric olsen, dan wenger

defense

d -line - ethan johnson - ian williams - brandon newman, kapron lewis moore
backers - fleming - brian smith - kerry neal or sergio brown depending on situation
cb - darrin walls - gary gray or raeshon mcneil
ss - dan macarthy
fs - harrison smith

to this you add depth at rb, linebacker and safety and you have a bcs team.

but we have to be patient and wait,, wait just one more year.

 

[WaveDomer]

Good post

Good post

Good post at UHND: Before Everyone Overreacts… Some Positives from MSU - UHND.com Blog

 

[NDinL.A.]

NDMontana, if you want to see Crist play here and there, then again, to put it bluntly, that's a stupid argument. He's so far behind that he couldn't beat out Evan Sharpley, and you want to burn his redshirt??? Why? So he can get buried behind our soft O-line? Didn't we all see that last year?

Clausen has an average arm? Are you kidding me? I URGE you to go back and watch the game. The hardest throw to make in football is the deep out, annd go back and watch a couple throws to Floyd. My goodness can he throw a fastball. Now, he has loads of room to improve, but again, go back to me USC argument. Not one of their QBs has had to play as even a true sophomore.

As for being a realist, hey, you're preaching to the choir. Look at my old posts. That's all I've been saying, is to keep it real. So having said that, we were 3-9 last year, so we're not just gonna turn it around and win 11 games this year. Not gonna happen. Nobody who is an ND fan wants 'moral victories', but I saw improvement yesterday. I saw young talent all over the field. And if you're a realist, you'll understand that this is a PROCESS, not a quick fix. Don't be fooled by the score. Stay the course, we're on to something here.

And like I said, make sure you come back and eat that crow when Clausen and Floyd (NOT KUMARA) go off in a BCS bowl game in 1-2 years, led by CW. (and not just you NDMontana, there a few of you guys on this thread banging on Clausen)...

 

[NDOM]

All I keep hearing is wait till next year! Wait till next year. Well I keep waiting and waiting and waiting and still NOTHING!

Dont get me wrong here, I love my Irish and always will but some of you are just drinking waaaaaaaaaay too much Koolaide

 

[Brown]

When you have a lot of young developing talent, and top recruiting classes, you'll always hear "wait till next year"

This team still has Fr/So starting at majority of the positions.

 

[GreenGoblin]

Notre Dame isn't a program that should "wait till next year" we are going to be bad for two seasons, we haven't won a bowl game for God knows how long, were pulling in top level recruiting classes and its always "wait till next year"

You know what? I would wait till next year, if we had a real football coach coaching these players. Not an NFL coordinator whose success was based off filming other teams during games. Hows Romeo Crennel doing? The same thing. Skip, get your ass over here and run these boys into the ground until we get back to where we belong, at the top.

 

[PADOMERNUT]

Crist will not play this year, get over it!!!

 

[NDsuperfan09]

A couple of you guys are unbelievable. Jimmy Clausen has an NFL arm; how you can't see the zip on his throws is beyond me. He had a Junior College line in front of him last year, and this year isn't a whole lot better. When he torches teams later this year and the next two years with those stud (YOUNG) wide receivers, I HOPE you come back here ready to eat crow. It's not his fault Kumara can't catch, and when he does catch stronger players rip the ball from him. He needs to read defenses better, I agree. But HE'S A SOPHOMORE PLAYING BEHIND A BELOW AVERAGE LINE.

Amen. The thing NDmontana is questioning though is probably how he floats his deep ball too much at times. He needs to put less floating on the deep ball. Thats my only concern. Am I the only one who thinks we should go Texas Tech style and throws the ball a lot the rest of the year. Clausen and the WR looked like they could be dealy minus the mistakes in that type of Offense at least until we find a running game.

 

[NDMontana]

First, five yard outs are not "deep outs". Second, I know four men with college football coaching experience and one w/ NFL and college experience; to a man they think that Jimmy Clausen is nothing special. My assessment comes directly from what I've seen and what they've said: Average arm, below average mobility, a hitch in his throw and no apparent ability to read defenses.

You want to talk about BCS in one-two years? In 2005 and 2006 we were invited to play in BCS games; we got dominated in both games. In 2005 and 2006 we had fairly difficult schedules; from 2007 on our schedules are ridiculously soft. The AP/Coaches are not going to put Notre Dame in another BCS game in the foreseeable future because it's not fair to some of the other teams who may put up a strong showing. Let's set reasonable goals like, oh I don't know, finishing about .500 or winning a bowl game, ANY BOWL GAME. Our last postseason victory was 1994!

I didn't expect to see our 2008 version of ND setting the world ablaze but I thought I would see progress. A comeback win over San Diego State (who was beaten by an FCS team the week before), a gift wrapped victory over Michigan and a solid drubbing at the hands of MSU. The San Diego win was no more impressive than the win over Duke or Stanford last year. We didn't beat Michigan; Michigan beat themselves. MSU ran all over us.

Ranks:
Offense
Rush yards per game: 112th
Passing yards per game: 70th
Total Offense: 108th
Pts. per game: 90th

Defense (I couldn't find per game averages only total yards, tds, etc. given up):
YPG: 67th
Rushing yards: 51st

Because I couldn't find average rushing yards against it's important to note that it is based on total rushing yards given up. So several teams who have given up less rushing yards have played one more game than we have. There are several teams who aren't that far below us that have given up only a few more yards but, again, have played one more game. SO in reality our rushing defense is probably about 90th.

PROGRESS??

 

[NDMontana]

Amen. The thing NDmontana is questioning though is probably how he floats his deep ball too much at times. He needs to put less floating on the deep ball. Thats my only concern. Am I the only one who thinks we should go Texas Tech style and throws the ball a lot the rest of the year. Clausen and the WR looked like they could be dealy minus the mistakes in that type of Offense at least until we find a running game.

The Texas Tech comment is hilarious! One of my buddies is a fireman and he had to work yesterday so he watched the game and we were texting. At one point he sent me a text that said: "Didn't Charlie go down and learn special teams from Beamer this year? Maybe he next year he should learn Texas Tech's offense!"

Maybe it is a good idea....we obviously can't run so why not just toss the ball all over the field?

 

[renesikaffynd]

All I keep hearing is wait till next year! Wait till next year. Well I keep waiting and waiting and waiting and still NOTHING!

Dont get me wrong here, I love my Irish and always will but some of you are just drinking waaaaaaaaaay too much Koolaide

for example: in the quinn days, how could you expect to win with such mediocre players on defense such as richardson, lambert, ferrine, frome, crum, travis thomas, brockinton

and on ofense darius walker, david grimes, and the whole offensive line sucked and with reason because they were all 3 -stars.

the only good part of these teams were the quarterback - quinn, trevor laws, abiamiri, samardzija and mcnkight, and zbikowski, they stepped up to much sometimes , especially quinn who had to sacrifice his physical integrity on almost every play becuase of those retards in the offensive line and their piece of shit coach john latina. who cannot even counter a simple defensive line scheme as you all saw yesterday with mich. state.

so dont say that we could win with those teams please, be realistic a lot of those players overachieved sometimes and we were overrated most of the time,, playing ohio state and LSU in bowl games - not a chance.

so when bullard, watt, and zach martin are sophomores along with trevor robinson being a junior and stewart and olsen being seniors and we DONT win a championship, you can say what you just said and criticize weis, but,, i garrantee we will win a NC.

 

[NDOM]

Blah blah blah. Nice 2nd post. Obviously you arent watching the same game as the rest of us. And why are you singling me out? You obviosly have no IDEA what you're talking about.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

"and I agree, Weis hasn't done anything to prove to me, or the die hard Notre Dame faithful that he is right for the job..."

He won many games his first 2 years as a head ND coach.


"They are young? Sorry the "young" excuse is over. We have four juniors and senior starting on our offensive line. They are far from young."

They are younger than the opponents, and they have to go to class.

"Our line is fat, slow and consistently gets over-powered by players, whether they are from USC or San Diego State."

Agree

Sorry, don't yet know how to correctly edit and make my point. I will learn.

 

[NDOM]

I concur my friend. You're right.

 

[GreenGoblin]

mod edit: please do not attack other members. if someone attacks you or another poster, the triangle with the "l" in it below your name is the button to push.

 

[NDOM]

No crap Goblin! 99% of that stuff I never said. What a homer!

 

[Golden_Domer88]

So how about them Cubs?!

 

[NDinL.A.]

First, five yard outs are not "deep outs". Second, I know four men with college football coaching experience and one w/ NFL and college experience; to a man they think that Jimmy Clausen is nothing special. My assessment comes directly from what I've seen and what they've said: Average arm, below average mobility, a hitch in his throw and no apparent ability to read defenses.

You want to talk about BCS in one-two years? In 2005 and 2006 we were invited to play in BCS games; we got dominated in both games. In 2005 and 2006 we had fairly difficult schedules; from 2007 on our schedules are ridiculously soft. The AP/Coaches are not going to put Notre Dame in another BCS game in the foreseeable future because it's not fair to some of the other teams who may put up a strong showing. Let's set reasonable goals like, oh I don't know, finishing about .500 or winning a bowl game, ANY BOWL GAME. Our last postseason victory was 1994!

I didn't expect to see our 2008 version of ND setting the world ablaze but I thought I would see progress. A comeback win over San Diego State (who was beaten by an FCS team the week before), a gift wrapped victory over Michigan and a solid drubbing at the hands of MSU. The San Diego win was no more impressive than the win over Duke or Stanford last year. We didn't beat Michigan; Michigan beat themselves. MSU ran all over us.

Ranks:
Offense
Rush yards per game: 112th
Passing yards per game: 70th
Total Offense: 108th
Pts. per game: 90th

Defense (I couldn't find per game averages only total yards, tds, etc. given up):
YPG: 67th
Rushing yards: 51st

Because I couldn't find average rushing yards against it's important to note that it is based on total rushing yards given up. So several teams who have given up less rushing yards have played one more game than we have. There are several teams who aren't that far below us that have given up only a few more yards but, again, have played one more game. SO in reality our rushing defense is probably about 90th.

PROGRESS??

Yeah, and I know Bill Walsh, Knute Rockne, Vince Lombardi, and Joe Montana's great grandfather, and they all, to a man, think Clausen is an NFL player in the making.

Dude, unless you're going to name drop all the way so we can Google your 'friends' that are all 'ex-NFL' and college guys, save it. Anyone can say that stuff.

You need to watch the game again. Count to 5. Then keep counting. Floyd was catching much longer than 5 yard outs. Again, watch the game again, and please pay closer attention to the zip on his passes. Then come on here.

So let me get this straight: Michigan gift-wrapped the game for us, yet MSU pounded us, even though we gave them the same breaks Mich gave us. Again, you sound like you don't really watch football. Sorry. You can't have it both ways. Which one is it?

You see, the truth is MSU didn't kill us, we were down by 9 in the 4th with a chance to make it a one possession game. Our kicker missed his 2nd FG of the game, and MSU scored a late TD. We also fumbled near the goal line, and and had Kumara catch a TD only to get outmuscled in the end zone. Hardly a pounding bro. We left tons of points on the field. We lost, and I take it like a man. We didn't giftwrap the game, we just lost it. And Mich didn't giftwrap the game either.

There's tons of progress, which I already outlined earlier, but in true TROLL fashion, you chose to ignore it. Whatever...

 

[Junkhead]

piece of shit coach john latina.

Can't argue that.

 

[NDMontana]

Yeah, and I know Bill Walsh, Knute Rockne, Vince Lombardi, and Joe Montana's great grandfather, and they all, to a man, think Clausen is an NFL player in the making.

Dude, unless you're going to name drop all the way so we can Google your 'friends' that are all 'ex-NFL' and college guys, save it. Anyone can say that stuff.

You need to watch the game again. Count to 5. Then keep counting. Floyd was catching much longer than 5 yard outs. Again, watch the game again, and please pay closer attention to the zip on his passes. Then come on here.

So let me get this straight: Michigan gift-wrapped the game for us, yet MSU pounded us, even though we gave them the same breaks Mich gave us. Again, you sound like you don't really watch football. Sorry. You can't have it both ways. Which one is it?

You see, the truth is MSU didn't kill us, we were down by 9 in the 4th with a chance to make it a one possession game. Our kicker missed his 2nd FG of the game, and MSU scored a late TD. We also fumbled near the goal line, and and had Kumara catch a TD only to get outmuscled in the end zone. Hardly a pounding bro. We left tons of points on the field. We lost, and I take it like a man. We didn't giftwrap the game, we just lost it. And Mich didn't giftwrap the game either.

There's tons of progress, which I already outlined earlier, but in true TROLL fashion, you chose to ignore it. Whatever...

Go check the team offensive team rankings and compare them to last year. Than tell me about progress.

Coaches: Mick Delaney (Uncle) Coached at Stanford, Miami, New England, Colorado St. and is now assisting at the University of Montana in his retirement.

Sonny Lubick: Coached at Montana State, Miami, Stanford and Colorado St. (twice).

The other guys you probably couldn't google.

 

[NDinL.A.]

Go check the team offensive team rankings and compare them to last year. Than tell me about progress.

Coaches: Mick Delaney (Uncle) Coached at Stanford, Miami, New England, Colorado St. and is now assisting at the University of Montana in his retirement.

Sonny Lubick: Coached at Montana State, Miami, Stanford and Colorado St. (twice).

The other guys you probably couldn't google.

Yeah, and I went to Justin Tuck's wedding, and I talked to players there that said they loved Charlie Weis. So does that make me right or you right about CW?

We all have our opinions. The great Bill Walsh has been HORRIBLY wrong about QB's from time to time. He loved Leinart coming out of college. Who knows who is right? You can throw numbers at me all you want, but I'll go by my eyes. It's so damn early, the numbers will play out at the end. If you know football as you say you'd know that. But my eyes tell me that Clausen's arm strength is sick and he's improved immensely, Floyd is a legit stud, Tate is from another planet, the line can at least pass block this year, etc.

Now, there's tons of improvement still needed, but we're going in the right direction. Sorry you don't agree w/ us on that...

 

[realitycheck]

If JC's arm strength is "sick" why does he put so much air under all his throws?

 

[JeremyND07]

clausen is only a sophmore!!!! I am not a big JC fan but he has shown A LOT of improvement this year!!! Those of you with short term memory loss do not remember Quinn's Sophmore year...he stunk!!!! If JC starts of next year like this year that is a different story!!! Our biggest problem is Latina period...no push on the OL. Pass blocking is just about getting in the way...run blocking is about being aggressive blowing people of the ball. We are the worst run blocking team in the NCAA right now!!!!!! If Latina makes it through the season I will be VERY surprised!!!!!

 

[irish4ever]

How long do I have to wait?

Until he gets it right!

 

[phork]

I get nervous when he goes to throw it away because it seems like he can't even get it to the sideline if he is not in a proper throwing stance.

 

[NDinL.A.]

If JC's arm strength is "sick" why does he put so much air under all his throws?

How many TD's this year have happened when he puts 'too much air under his throws'? Ummm, pretty much all of them. It's called a fade, and he throws an incredible fade ball. Unfortuantely, he throws it sometimes to Kumara and not Floyd, which results in an INT. They need to stop calling that damn play so much and start using the middle of the field. Then you'll see even more success. Again, watch for the zip on his throws.

He needs to improve. But again, HE'S ONLY A SOPHOMORE! Leinart, Booty, Sanchez, all in pro-style systems, all were sitting and watching at this point of their careers...

 

[PADOMERNUT]

very good point on the USC qb's. Most if not all of them were sitting and learning until their junior year's. JC is learning on the job with others who are learning on the job.

 

[mick2]

very good point on the USC qb's. Most if not all of them were sitting and learning until their junior year's. JC is learning on the job with others who are learning on the job.

yes and you can pretty much go down the usc position list and see that there has been a stud at every position that those guys sat and learned from, jimmy had no-one, just like brady had no-one, but dayne has jimmy to watch and get a feel from and whatever other qb that comes in after dayne will have them to look to for advice, and the incoming classes will have those soon to be juniors to look up to, and so on and so on. Playing freshman is good but throwing them to the fire like we have had to do will bear consequences.

its like starting a job, you get training, you go out make a few mistakes here and there, get more training, the mistakes lessen, and more training until it becomes routine, but even when it becomes routine there is still a possibility of mistakes but you learn from them and grow.

Rebuilding a program doesnt happen overnight and i am glad some people understand that.

EDIT- i wish more people would understand that.