2025 Master Thread

domer13

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Not trying to be sky is falling guy...but 8 of our 17 commits are 3 stars. Not a great ratio.
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Just to put some context here - at this point, 11 of the 17 are below 90 on the 247 Composite. But, like many have said, the rankings for most should go up - ESPN hasn't put out rankings for many here. And our Likely/Possible Commits should raise the blue-chip ratio considerably.

So far, Freeman has done a much better job of avoiding the lower range commits (below 88, 87, etc.) that Kelly often had but also hasn't gotten the quantity of high level (above 95, 97, etc.) type recruits that someone like Weis could.
 

OhioIrish

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Not trying to be sky is falling guy...but 8 of our 17 commits are 3 stars. Not a great ratio.
This is fair. It’s disappointing, but I think the culture change within the program can overcome the talent gap, at least temporarily— this level of recruiting is not a long term solution, though.
 

Ricochet

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So will Will Black. Dohn said when he committed he's gonna skyrocket. O-line class is a bunch of monsters.
Will Black is a stud and when it's all said and done I think he's a 5 star or close to it. Straight is a Top 75 talent IMO he could end up being more like a Top 50 prospect. Augustine is a Top 150 prospect.

This time 4 years ago Joe Alt was a 3 star TE, Cane Berrong was the #1 TE. Joe Alt ended up a 4 star OL and as we know the best in his class. Cane Berrong went from #1 to a 3 star who's done nothing. At TE if you guys remember we tried to get Thomas Fidone and Brock Bowers who ended up the #1 and #2 TE's in the class and missed out those guys with not so high ratings during the junior year. They wanted a 2nd TE in the class and guy got was an unranked Ohio QB named Mitchell Evans who ended up a 3 Star TE in the final rankings.

It's all about the traits and not necessarily about the rankings at this point of these consumer recruiting services. Just because Rivals, 247 and On3 rank players where they do doesn't mean the Staff sees it anything like that and I think we've really seen that with the guys Coaches Mickens and McCollough recruits. ND loves there CB class of Hobbs and Moore, they didn't settle on these guys but they don't see them as 3 stars like the recruiting services do and I agree with the staff with those 2.

To be honest I really like most of the 3 Stars they picked up in '24 recruiting class. I personally don't see it with the S though. Mullins I like but I get the ranking from where he was and missing his SR season. The OL might not be certified studs it's laughable that they are rated as 3 Stars. Like Hobbs and Moore I love the traits and potential of Kahoun and Rezac. Maybe because they'd aren't plug and play prospects it hurts there ranking but the athleticism and other traits are there.
 

a mike

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Maybe because they'd aren't plug and play prospects it hurts there ranking but the athleticism and other traits are there.
Think Freeman is clearly prioritizing traits over skill and feeling they can develop them once they're on campus (Rezac, Urlacher etc)

They're also clearly attempting to project guys in hopes of getting in on them and locking up before they blow up (K Keeley, B Young, Thurman, etc)

Sometimes its going to work out well and obviously sometimes it won't and maybe you end up with a too skinny kid or a guy that doesn't have it upstairs and ends up running around out there like a chicken with his head cut off

But I can at least respect/understand Freeman thought process and willingness/confidence to follow thru on it. Better than Kelly's grab-bagging best available approach

I also think the portal era gives coaches more wiggle room to deploy this type of strategy
 

Green Mountains

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I agree with stars from an overall strength of program / class viewpoint. But look at Matty Augustine.....3 stars who choose ND over OSU, Michigan, Penn State. The ranking services simply haven't caught up. He's from CT, so not a hot bed of D 1 talent. But a 3 star doesn't get those offers.

The rankings will catch up.
 

stpeteirish

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Black and Augustine are both playing for Prep Schools in New England. That's got to impact their ratings. If they were in the Atlanta suburbs or one of the big Catholic schools in SoCal they would be rated way higher.
 

dublinirish

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Black and Augustine are both playing for Prep Schools in New England. That's got to impact their ratings. If they were in the Atlanta suburbs or one of the big Catholic schools in SoCal they would be rated way higher.
Drew Pyne's failure to develop ruined CT football for ever
 

bumpdaddy

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To me, the biggest problem with complaining about 3 stars in the '25 class is that it's WAY too early to do so. We're just under a year away from the final rankings. The individual rankings will be changing several times between now and then. For those who say the recruiting services generally get it right (I'm in that group), well, when do they get it right? Because every ranking change they make between now and next February means their previous eval was wrong... and there's nothing wrong with that.

This is all to say, the only rankings that will matter are the final rankings. Worrying about how many 3-stars we have right now almost a year before the final rankings is wasted energy, IMO. Besides, if the coaching staff of a top-level program isn't better at evaluating talent at this stage of the game than the recruiting services then that coaching staff sucks. And I don't believe this coaching staff sucks at evaluating talent.
 

PutuporShutup

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To me, the biggest problem with complaining about 3 stars in the '25 class is that it's WAY too early to do so. We're just under a year away from the final rankings. The individual rankings will be changing several times between now and then. For those who say the recruiting services generally get it right (I'm in that group), well, when do they get it right? Because every ranking change they make between now and next February means their previous eval was wrong... and there's nothing wrong with that.

This is all to say, the only rankings that will matter are the final rankings. Worrying about how many 3-stars we have right now almost a year before the final rankings is wasted energy, IMO. Besides, if the coaching staff of a top-level program isn't better at evaluating talent at this stage of the game than the recruiting services then that coaching staff sucks. And I don't believe this coaching staff sucks at evaluating talent.
Agree. I actually think our most confusing/questionable commits so far are 4 star

A bunch of our 3 star recruits were much more highly sought after than a few of our 4 stars
 

NDpendent

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For the WR board, I haven't been able to follow the 2025 class as closely past 5 classes and have watched zero film on the WR offers. Can someone give me a cliff notes version of the board, where we stand with them, type of receiver they are and the pecking order talent wise?
 

Jiggafini19Deux

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Black and Augustine are both playing for Prep Schools in New England. That's got to impact their ratings. If they were in the Atlanta suburbs or one of the big Catholic schools in SoCal they would be rated way higher.
Because...optics.

I tend to lean toward putting more into the actual professionals are seeing when they evaluate high school kids. No offense to Mike Frank.
 

SeekNDestroy

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I agree with stars from an overall strength of program / class viewpoint. But look at Matty Augustine.....3 stars who choose ND over OSU, Michigan, Penn State. The ranking services simply haven't caught up. He's from CT, so not a hot bed of D 1 talent. But a 3 star doesn't get those offers.

The rankings will catch up.
I agree. Rankings don’t mean anything until January’25. Even then, they don’t mean as much as staff evaluations especially considering some of the incompetent clowns working for some of the recruiting services.
 

Rocketman84

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No it’s not… bettis is not good, Burress is coming on, meadows is all potential but insanely raw

Meadows burress and 2 other studs would be a very good class
At this point you really need to close with Meadows and one of the slot speedsters RVB/Hines/Cyrus or Howard. Bettis is a flyer if ONLY you land the other 2. We have one guy already with good "genes" and solid measurables who isn't very productive at the Prep level, and a shifty east/west without top end speed at this point. Need a rangy, tall specimen with speed and a flat out blazer before thinking about taking projects or flyers.
 

Rocketman84

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Will Black is a stud and when it's all said and done I think he's a 5 star or close to it. Straight is a Top 75 talent IMO he could end up being more like a Top 50 prospect. Augustine is a Top 150 prospect.

This time 4 years ago Joe Alt was a 3 star TE, Cane Berrong was the #1 TE. Joe Alt ended up a 4 star OL and as we know the best in his class. Cane Berrong went from #1 to a 3 star who's done nothing. At TE if you guys remember we tried to get Thomas Fidone and Brock Bowers who ended up the #1 and #2 TE's in the class and missed out those guys with not so high ratings during the junior year. They wanted a 2nd TE in the class and guy got was an unranked Ohio QB named Mitchell Evans who ended up a 3 Star TE in the final rankings.

It's all about the traits and not necessarily about the rankings at this point of these consumer recruiting services. Just because Rivals, 247 and On3 rank players where they do doesn't mean the Staff sees it anything like that and I think we've really seen that with the guys Coaches Mickens and McCollough recruits. ND loves there CB class of Hobbs and Moore, they didn't settle on these guys but they don't see them as 3 stars like the recruiting services do and I agree with the staff with those 2.

To be honest I really like most of the 3 Stars they picked up in '24 recruiting class. I personally don't see it with the S though. Mullins I like but I get the ranking from where he was and missing his SR season. The OL might not be certified studs it's laughable that they are rated as 3 Stars. Like Hobbs and Moore I love the traits and potential of Kahoun and Rezac. Maybe because they'd aren't plug and play prospects it hurts there ranking but the athleticism and other traits are there.
Cane Berrong was never the #1 TE in the country??? Albeit he was Top 5 going into his Jr year
 

stpeteirish

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Berrong was the 59th best player in the initial rankings on 4/15/19. I don't think there were 4 TEs between 1 and 58.
Yes he was #1 for a while albeit early in the cycle. Now he’s at Coastal Carolina. Excellent example of the fallacy of early ratings and their bias towards certain football hotbeds
 

Rocketman84

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Berrong was the 59th best player in the initial rankings on 4/15/19. I don't think there were 4 TEs between 1 and 58.
Well at that time he was 3rd according to 247 but that's one source (Matavao was #1), but he was a consensus Top 5 at the time after Soph year. Usually don't put stock into rankings until camps and events during Upperclassment years.
 

Rocketman84

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Yes he was #1 for a while albeit early in the cycle. Now he’s at Coastal Carolina. Excellent example of the fallacy of early ratings and their bias towards certain football hotbeds
Matavao was the consensus #1 in Summer '19 at #52.
 

PutuporShutup

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Yes he was #1 for a while albeit early in the cycle. Now he’s at Coastal Carolina. Excellent example of the fallacy of early ratings and their bias towards certain football hotbeds
Same with jack larsen… super duper early hype but he didn’t grow
 

notredomer23

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On3's updated 300:

#6 Will Black
#54 Deuce Knight
#121 Ivan Taylor
#126 James Flanigan
#156 Chris Burgess
#234 Owen Strebig
#240 Joseph Reiff

Top Targets:
#43 Jadon Blair
#57 Derek Meadows
#60 Darren Ikkenagbon
#76 Mark Zackery
#90 Talyn Taylor
#97 Noah Mikail
#107 Damien Shanklin
#113 Madden Farriamo
#114 Dallas Golden
#149 Raiden Vines Bright
#189 Marco Jones
#236 Devin Williams
#239 Jahmir Joseph
#245 Chuck McDonald

And the two most criminal rankings I've seen since CJ Carr:
#257 Jack Lange
#266 Nathaniel Owusu Boateng

This class has some SERIOUS potential to have the most top 200 recruits in a long time.
 
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