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  • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

    Actually it's not a "no brainer", but hey we're all for bigger government where more of my pay check can go to supporting it.
    It literally wont cost any money. Its logistics and standardized protocols. How does standardizing the days allowed to receive absentee votes cost anyone money? Do you object having the same hihgway signs mean the same thing in different states when you are driving?

    Im sure you are in favor of ID and sig matching? Yes? Im in favor of setting a disctinct period that allows absentee and mail in votes to be processed and counted (not arbitrarily politically motivated windows as there are now. Im also in favor of allowing all people who vote in person adequate time and access to vote in person. This is also arbitrary and can be changed without notice to voters.
    "From Chaos comes Clarity"

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

      Actually it's not a "no brainer", but hey we're all for bigger government where more of my pay check can go to supporting it.
      I'm not saying every state should be exactly the same, but we all should take a step back and realize that national voting standards / laws have been a thing for a very long time. And that most of them were put in place for very good reasons, or to combat some evil and/or undemocratic stuff being done to disenfranchise voters.

      There is a lot in HR1 that I think is fair to criticize, or is transparently slanted towards helping Democrats. At the same time, we've got Republicans in Georgia not just trying to make lines as long as possible in predominantly black areas... but also making it illegal to give people a bottle of water while they're standing in that long line. What year is this? 1965?

      The correct bill for this moment probably has a third of the content of HR 1... things like gerrymandering limits, mandating that all ballots have a physical paper trail that can be audited, etc. But instead you get that mixed with a bunch of partisan and unnecessary provisions because that's how politics works in this day and age.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

        I'm not saying every state should be exactly the same, but we all should take a step back and realize that national voting standards / laws have been a thing for a very long time. And that most of them were put in place for very good reasons, or to combat some evil and/or undemocratic stuff being done to disenfranchise voters.

        There is a lot in HR1 that I think is fair to criticize, or is transparently slanted towards helping Democrats. At the same time, we've got Republicans in Georgia not just trying to make lines as long as possible in predominantly black areas... but also making it illegal to give people a bottle of water while they're standing in that long line. What year is this? 1965?

        The correct bill for this moment probably has a third of the content of HR 1... things like gerrymandering limits, mandating that all ballots have a physical paper trail that can be audited, etc. But instead you get that mixed with a bunch of partisan and unnecessary provisions because that's how politics works in this day and age.
        You get it. You've got to get it whittled down, but until it is, this shouldn't be passed regardless of the crap both parties are doing.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

          It literally wont cost any money. Its logistics and standardized protocols. How does standardizing the days allowed to receive absentee votes cost anyone money? Do you object having the same hihgway signs mean the same thing in different states when you are driving?

          Im sure you are in favor of ID and sig matching? Yes? Im in favor of setting a disctinct period that allows absentee and mail in votes to be processed and counted (not arbitrarily politically motivated windows as there are now. Im also in favor of allowing all people who vote in person adequate time and access to vote in person. This is also arbitrary and can be changed without notice to voters.
          Logistics take money. Might make road trips a lot more fun!

          Comment


          • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

            I'm not saying every state should be exactly the same, but we all should take a step back and realize that national voting standards / laws have been a thing for a very long time. And that most of them were put in place for very good reasons, or to combat some evil and/or undemocratic stuff being done to disenfranchise voters.

            There is a lot in HR1 that I think is fair to criticize, or is transparently slanted towards helping Democrats. At the same time, we've got Republicans in Georgia not just trying to make lines as long as possible in predominantly black areas... but also making it illegal to give people a bottle of water while they're standing in that long line. What year is this? 1965?

            The correct bill for this moment probably has a third of the content of HR 1... things like gerrymandering limits, mandating that all ballots have a physical paper trail that can be audited, etc. But instead you get that mixed with a bunch of partisan and unnecessary provisions because that's how politics works in this day and age.
            Im not saying all states should be the exact same but.... saying that there should be well thought out minimums that cannot be changed by states arbitraily. You are rights on the things Georgia is doing. Arizona as well. NC has some completely wild rules....IMO any person ( legally able to vote) should be able to go to any state and vote and have a similar experience and prevent any voter from not being able to adequately cast their vote.
            Last edited by Cackalacky2.0; 03-04-2021, 05:22 PM.
            "From Chaos comes Clarity"

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

              No we dont have minimum standards. Every state is different. Its not standard if it can be arbitrarily changed right before elections occur. I look at it like road signage. I can go to any state in the union and I will see the same signs, mean the same thing, and are based off the same standard. Voting should be equally as available and simple. South Carolina cant just arbitrarily change the stop sign and replace it with something designed to be confusing. If I were to move to another state the voting experience should be the same. Easy and accessible.

              Its this easy.
              1. Voter ID required. ID must be based off you address associated with your IRS taxes. Government can aid in getting an ID to people who need it. It can be forwarded with your W-2 or Welfare applications or some other federal level document.
              2. Each election, absentee ballots are acceptable for any reason ( not some random made up list like it is in my state). Absentee ballots can be cast from some specific time before and after election.
              3. Each election, mail in ballots are acceptable and subject to sig and ID match. Mail in ballot are allowed to be received some specific time before and after election.
              4. Each election, in person voting will be held at same locations without closing or changing venues at the last moment. Voters must be notified a change of venue. In person voting also subject to ID and sig match.
              5. Every state will standardize counting. All votes must be received by a certain day and counting done and certified by another day.
              That's it. Every state follows the same protocol in setting up and conducting mail in, absentee and in person voting. The fact North Carolina and Nevada doesn't finish counting for nearly two weeks after the election is egregious when Virginia and other more populous states can get it done in days is ridiculous.
              We do have minimum standards. They might not be to your liking, but they exist. Voting standards need to comply with the constitution and whatever Congress has put in place.

              Why do you think the judiciary has struck down specific voting laws (poll taxes, some voter ID laws for example)? States have broad authority to manage things on their own, but its not some carte blanche wild west deal.

              I'm with you on a lot of the problems. It shouldn't take as long as it does to vote, shouldn't take them as long as it does in some places to count the votes, etc. I just don't see the Feds coming up with a satisfactory set of standards.

              Hopefully the more egregious violators of all of these problems get shamed into doing better (being less shady, being more efficient, etc.) like Florida did after 2000.

              Based Mullet Kid owns

              Comment


              • So nobody defending the idea that 16-year-olds shout vote (insane) or legalizing ballot harvesting?
                Running the damn ball since 2017.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by drayer54 View Post
                  So nobody defending the idea that 16-year-olds shout vote (insane) or legalizing ballot harvesting?
                  My dream is to end up a house rep like the bald bish who proposed that. She has guaranteed job security forever. Gets paid very well to propose 16 year olds voting.

                  She will never accomplish anything. But she will never have to work a day in her life either.
                  Based Mullet Kid owns

                  Comment


                  • I am curious when someone within the Biden camp will come out and let us know what is going on with Biden. He is obviously NOT running the ship. Even if his mental capacity was not in question, this is not normal.

                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-BOjz4f5zU

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Blazers46 View Post
                      I am curious when someone within the Biden camp will come out and let us know what is going on with Biden. He is obviously NOT running the ship. Even if his mental capacity was not in question, this is not normal.

                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-BOjz4f5zU
                      Anyone who has seen the videos of him a few years ago vs. now knows the dude is done.

                      I see the libs on twitter are calling for primary challengers for all these red/purple state D senators. Eight of them. Like...
                      .you guys trying to give the GOP 60 senate seats by 2024?

                      Its always funny how silly people get when senators don't vote exactly the way they want. Its a both sides thing obviously but its super common right now. Like dude, have you considered that there is a reason Susan Collins, Joe Manchin, etc. win?

                      We got libs going apeshit over these guys not voting to raise the minimum wage... we got the Trump crowd vowing to primary everyone who isn't an acolyte...shits going B-A-N-A-N-A-S. I wonder if 2022 and 2024 can serve as a weird sort of reset.

                      Could see a bunch of establishment/moderates lose primaries to more extreme candidates only to lose in the general on both sides of the aisle.





                      Based Mullet Kid owns

                      Comment


                      • Personally, I don't mind them doing a weekend at Bernie's with Biden. President Klain > President Harris. The more time they spend covering up his rapid mental decay, the less time they spend ruining our country.
                        Running the damn ball since 2017.

                        Comment


                        • I just don't see him making it four years. I think Kamala takes over, I thought the same even before the election. It's odd to be this invisible during a pandemic and a struggling economy as a result of said pandemic. Something isn't right there, and the stream getting cut like that is telling.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by ulukinatme View Post
                            I just don't see him making it four years. I think Kamala takes over, I thought the same even before the election. It's odd to be this invisible during a pandemic and a struggling economy as a result of said pandemic. Something isn't right there, and the stream getting cut like that is telling.
                            He's coming out of hiding Thursday, but it looks like it will be a very controlled meeting.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                              He's coming out of hiding Thursday, but it looks like it will be a very controlled meeting.
                              Is it Groundhogs Day again?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                                He's coming out of hiding Thursday, but it looks like it will be a very controlled meeting.
                                Nice shot of B12 and a couple softballs from CNN about the new color scheme of Air Force One?
                                The yellow mustard pants are hideous and have to go.

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by Polish Leppy 22 View Post

                                  Nice shot of B12 and a couple softballs from CNN about the new color scheme of Air Force One?
                                  Spot on. If it weren't so sad, I would laugh.

                                  Comment


                                  • Andrea May Sahouri acquitted.

                                    Merrick Garland confirmed.

                                    Recovery Act done.

                                    Mass vaccine distribution site is opening less than two miles from me in my village.

                                    Massive day. Best in a really really long time in my bubble because I don't really care about what gender a potatohead toy is.
                                    It is no coincidence that the growth of modern tyrants has in every case been heralded by the growth of prejudice.

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by Rogue219 View Post
                                      Andrea May Sahouri acquitted.

                                      Merrick Garland confirmed.

                                      Recovery Act done.

                                      Mass vaccine distribution site is opening less than two miles from me in my village.

                                      Massive day. Best in a really really long time in my bubble because I don't really care about what gender a potatohead toy is.
                                      Yeah it’s weird what people are choosing to care about while Biden has a 70%+ approval rating in his handling of COVID, vaccination rates are through the roof, and a stimulus package just passed that has 75% public approval and will benefit most Americans either directly or indirectly. Shrug.

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

                                        Yeah it’s weird what people are choosing to care about while Biden has a 70%+ approval rating in his handling of COVID, vaccination rates are through the roof, and a stimulus package just passed that has 75% public approval and will benefit most Americans either directly or indirectly. Shrug.
                                        Just sheer curiousity on what has Biden really done with Covid besides not be Trump? I haven't followed Covid since my state went from "going with science" then going by with their "gut" to who really knows anymore what they are doing... so I stopped caring.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by Blazers46 View Post

                                          Just sheer curiousity on what has Biden really done with Covid besides not be Trump? I haven't followed Covid since my state went from "going with science" then going by with their "gut" to who really knows anymore what they are doing... so I stopped caring.
                                          I think that the main driver in different perceptions comes down to what they're saying and how they're saying it. Compare these two public statements today:
                                          Trump -- https://twitter.com/secupp/status/13...797999626?s=20
                                          Biden -- https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/136...585735687?s=20

                                          The first is not only a truly insane lie that insults the intelligence of the reader, but it is self-aggrandizing and only exists to demand some form of thanks and adulation. The second is all about saying "this is what I'm doing for you." Regardless of what merit you want to give either statement, one comes off completely different than the other. Most people who see something like Trump's statement are going to have a negative reaction even if it were true. Most people who see Biden's statement are going to have a positive reaction. One statement is simply better optics than the other.

                                          The other part is that I think people are naturally going to react positively to how vaccination rates continue to both go up + exceed targets + be better than the rest of the first world. And they implicitly give Biden some credit for that. In actuality, the chief differences between Trump and Biden mostly boil down to their distribution plans. Trump's vaccine strategy was allocating vaccines to states and saying "good luck." Biden's administration has been far more hands on in assisting with distribution of vaccines and supplies, as well as offering direct assistance to any state or locality that asks. They are directly assisting with more vaccination sites being set up each week across the country. They also stopped holding vaccines for as long and started distributing them to states faster in a more organized manner. All of these are positive developments, and conversely there haven't really been any blunders or setbacks to criticize Biden on.

                                          Comment


                                          • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

                                            Yeah it’s weird what people are choosing to care about while Biden has a 70%+ approval rating in his handling of COVID, vaccination rates are through the roof, and a stimulus package just passed that has 75% public approval and will benefit most Americans either directly or indirectly. Shrug.
                                            Eh...claiming the package has 75% approval seems a bit silly.

                                            People want a check. You'd have a hard time convincing me that 75% of people approve of 90% of the shit in that thing. Once word gets around that the Dems used "covid" to send billions to special interests.....I suspect the approval will change. A lot of that is on the GOP for doing a poor job with messaging.

                                            That thing is a complete disaster and that will become clear over time. Sending the checks is dumb/bad enough, but the other stuff is truly indefensible. Even lib economists have as much.
                                            Based Mullet Kid owns

                                            Comment


                                            • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

                                              Yeah it’s weird what people are choosing to care about while Biden has a 70%+ approval rating in his handling of COVID, vaccination rates are through the roof, and a stimulus package just passed that has 75% public approval and will benefit most Americans either directly or indirectly. Shrug.

                                              I think that the main driver in different perceptions comes down to what they're saying and how they're saying it. Compare these two public statements today:
                                              Yep, it's all about the delivery and timing. On COVID, Biden basically took over right when the production and distribution was finally getting the kinks out and starting to get up a head of steam. On relief payments, it could have been Satan in office and his approval rating would be great when it comes to giving out free money. lol

                                              Comment


                                              • Originally posted by NorthDakota View Post

                                                Eh...claiming the package has 75% approval seems a bit silly.

                                                People want a check. You'd have a hard time convincing me that 75% of people approve of 90% of the shit in that thing. Once word gets around that the Dems used "covid" to send billions to special interests.....I suspect the approval will change. A lot of that is on the GOP for doing a poor job with messaging.

                                                That thing is a complete disaster and that will become clear over time. Sending the checks is dumb/bad enough, but the other stuff is truly indefensible. Even lib economists have as much.
                                                You speak in vague generalities and don’t actually point to any specific aspects of the bill that will be unpopular. I don’t consider putting more money in the pockets of the working class and parents with young children to be ‘special interests.’ Maybe you’re referring to the bailout of the aviation industry, but I wouldn’t bank on the American public getting angry at President Biden for saving 13,000 good paying jobs.

                                                This is a good bill that’s going to help a lot of people, including children living in poverty through no fault of their own. It’s not ‘truly indefensible’ as you say. What is truly indefensible is giving a major tax cut to the wealthiest 1% of earners in the middle of an economic boom while we’re trillions of dollars in debt. President Biden’s bill doesn’t do that, the former guy’s did.

                                                Comment


                                                • Originally posted by NorthDakota View Post

                                                  Eh...claiming the package has 75% approval seems a bit silly.

                                                  People want a check. You'd have a hard time convincing me that 75% of people approve of 90% of the shit in that thing. Once word gets around that the Dems used "covid" to send billions to special interests.....I suspect the approval will change. A lot of that is on the GOP for doing a poor job with messaging.

                                                  That thing is a complete disaster and that will become clear over time. Sending the checks is dumb/bad enough, but the other stuff is truly indefensible. Even lib economists have as much.
                                                  The first and last ones listed are my favorites.
                                                  • $1.5 million earmarked for the Seaway International Bridge, which connects New York to Canada. Senate Leader Chuck Schumer hails from New York.
                                                  • $50 million for “family planning” – going to non-profits, i.e. Planned Parenthood, or public entities, including for “services for adolescents[.]”
                                                  • $852 million for AmeriCorps, AmeriCorps Vista, and the National Senior Service Corps – the Corporation for National and Community Service – civic volunteer agencies. This includes $9 million for the AmeriCorp inspector general to conduct oversight and audits of the largess. AmeriCorps received a $1.1 billion FY2020 appropriation.
                                                  • The Wall Street Journal editorial board estimated that only $825 billion was directly related to Covid-19 relief and $1 trillion was “expansions of progressive programs, pork, and unrelated policy changes.”

                                                    For example, separately, our auditors found that $470 million in the bill doubles the budgets of The Institute of Museum and Library Services and the National Endowment of the Arts and the Humanities.
                                                  • $200 million in the bill to The Institute of Museum and Library Services (FY2019 budget: $230 million). This agency is so small that it doesn’t even employ an inspector general.
                                                  • $270 million funds the National Endowment of the Arts and the Humanities (FY2019 budget: $253 million) – In 2017, our study showed eighty-percent of all non-profit grant making flowed to well-heeled organizations with over $1 million in assets.
                                                  • $350 billion to bailout the 50 States and the District of Columbia. The allocation formula uses the unemployment rate in the fourth quarter of 2020. Therefore, states like New York and California –who had strict economic lockdown policies and high unemployment – will get bailout money. States like Florida and South Dakota – who were open for business – will get less.
                                                  • $128.5 billion to fund K-12 education. The CBO determined that most of the money in education will be distributed in 2022 through 2028, when the pandemic is over.
                                                  • $86 billion to save nearly 200 pension plans insured by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. There are no reforms mandated while these badly managed pensions are bailed-out. Many of these pension plans are co-managed by unions.
                                                  • $50 billion goes to the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). A portion of these funds is earmarked to reimburse up to $7,000 for funeral and burial costs related to Covid-19 deaths.
                                                  • $39.6 billion to higher education. This amount is three times the money – $12.5 billion – that higher ed received with the massive CARES Act funding from last March.
                                                  • $1.5 billion for Amtrak – the National Railroad Passenger Corporation. In FY2020, Congress appropriated $3 billion for Amtrak ($2 billion in annual appropriations, plus an additional $1 billion in the CARES Act COVID relief bill). In the three years before the pandemic, AMTRAK lost $392 million – even after a $5 billion taxpayer subsidy (FY2017-FY2019).
                                                  • $50 million for environmental justice grants.Per Politifact, the bill appropriates to the Environmental Protection Agency $50 million for “grants, contracts and other agency activities that implement the environmental justice purposes and objectives” described in “Federal Actions to Address Environmental Justice in Minority Populations and Low-Income Populations,” an executive order signed by President Bill Clinton in 1994; and President Joe Biden’s “Tackling the Climate Crisis at Home and Abroad” executive order.
                                                  • More than $100 million for an underground rail project in Silicon Valley. The bill allots $1.25 billion for federal transit capital investment grants.
                                                  Last edited by Irish#1; 03-11-2021, 09:30 AM.

                                                  Comment


                                                  • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                                                    The first and last ones listed are my favorites.
                                                    • $1.5 million earmarked for the Seaway International Bridge, which connects New York to Canada. Senate Leader Chuck Schumer hails from New York.
                                                    • $50 million for “family planning” – going to non-profits, i.e. Planned Parenthood, or public entities, including for “services for adolescents[.]”
                                                    • $852 million for AmeriCorps, AmeriCorps Vista, and the National Senior Service Corps – the Corporation for National and Community Service – civic volunteer agencies. This includes $9 million for the AmeriCorp inspector general to conduct oversight and audits of the largess. AmeriCorps received a $1.1 billion FY2020 appropriation.
                                                    • The Wall Street Journal editorial board estimated that only $825 billion was directly related to Covid-19 relief and $1 trillion was “expansions of progressive programs, pork, and unrelated policy changes.”

                                                      For example, separately, our auditors found that $470 million in the bill doubles the budgets of The Institute of Museum and Library Services and the National Endowment of the Arts and the Humanities.
                                                    • $200 million in the bill to The Institute of Museum and Library Services (FY2019 budget: $230 million). This agency is so small that it doesn’t even employ an inspector general.
                                                    • $270 million funds the National Endowment of the Arts and the Humanities (FY2019 budget: $253 million) – In 2017, our study showed eighty-percent of all non-profit grant making flowed to well-heeled organizations with over $1 million in assets.
                                                    • $350 billion to bailout the 50 States and the District of Columbia. The allocation formula uses the unemployment rate in the fourth quarter of 2020. Therefore, states like New York and California –who had strict economic lockdown policies and high unemployment – will get bailout money. States like Florida and South Dakota – who were open for business – will get less.
                                                    • $128.5 billion to fund K-12 education. The CBO determined that most of the money in education will be distributed in 2022 through 2028, when the pandemic is over.
                                                    • $86 billion to save nearly 200 pension plans insured by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. There are no reforms mandated while these badly managed pensions are bailed-out. Many of these pension plans are co-managed by unions.
                                                    • $50 billion goes to the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). A portion of these funds is earmarked to reimburse up to $7,000 for funeral and burial costs related to Covid-19 deaths.
                                                    • $39.6 billion to higher education. This amount is three times the money – $12.5 billion – that higher ed received with the massive CARES Act funding from last March.
                                                    • $1.5 billion for Amtrak – the National Railroad Passenger Corporation. In FY2020, Congress appropriated $3 billion for Amtrak ($2 billion in annual appropriations, plus an additional $1 billion in the CARES Act COVID relief bill). In the three years before the pandemic, AMTRAK lost $392 million – even after a $5 billion taxpayer subsidy (FY2017-FY2019).
                                                    • $50 million for environmental justice grants.Per Politifact, the bill appropriates to the Environmental Protection Agency $50 million for “grants, contracts and other agency activities that implement the environmental justice purposes and objectives” described in “Federal Actions to Address Environmental Justice in Minority Populations and Low-Income Populations,” an executive order signed by President Bill Clinton in 1994; and President Joe Biden’s “Tackling the Climate Crisis at Home and Abroad” executive order.
                                                    • More than $100 million for an underground rail project in Silicon Valley. The bill allots $1.25 billion for federal transit capital investment grants.
                                                    90% of that bill is hot garbage and does nothing relative to Covid.
                                                    The yellow mustard pants are hideous and have to go.

                                                    Comment


                                                    • Originally posted by Polish Leppy 22 View Post

                                                      90% of that bill is hot garbage and does nothing relative to Covid.
                                                      79% of the bill is either directly related to COVID, or tangentially related to COVID. 44% of the bill is direct aid to individuals. 9% is to help schools reopen as soon as possible. 18% is COVID aid to states and localities to help with vaccinations and other COVID related costs.

                                                      It does include some measures that aren't directly related to COVID. It is a budget and spending bill after all, and that's how it's being passed. For example, it includes a $300/kid monthly tax credit (that comes in the form of direct deposit checks) that will do more to end child poverty in this country than any piece of legislation passed in at least the past 20 years and is especially necessary given the impact of COVID on family structure // schools being closed. This is not a Democratic boondoggle, Mitt Romney was the first to propose a similar measure, and it's frankly amazing policy. If you want to criticize Democrat pork be my guest, but let's not pretend that only 10% of the bill has anything to do with COVID or that there isn't very good policy in it to help many Americans.

                                                      Comment


                                                      • Originally posted by longliveautrydenson View Post

                                                        You speak in vague generalities and don’t actually point to any specific aspects of the bill that will be unpopular. I don’t consider putting more money in the pockets of the working class and parents with young children to be ‘special interests.’ Maybe you’re referring to the bailout of the aviation industry, but I wouldn’t bank on the American public getting angry at President Biden for saving 13,000 good paying jobs.

                                                        This is a good bill that’s going to help a lot of people, including children living in poverty through no fault of their own. It’s not ‘truly indefensible’ as you say. What is truly indefensible is giving a major tax cut to the wealthiest 1% of earners in the middle of an economic boom while we’re trillions of dollars in debt. President Biden’s bill doesn’t do that, the former guy’s did.
                                                        Just imagine how many people it could help if it:
                                                        A. Allocated ALL of the money that will be or already has come out of taxpayers pockets to helping people and addressing the consequences of the pandemic, rather than roughly 20% of it.
                                                        B. Even if the money allocated to actual C19 relief efforts was the entire bill, it would cost Americans a whole lot less money than having us fund the billions of dollars in garbage in the bills that has nothing to do with the pandemic.
                                                        People believe what they want to believe, facts be damned. There is a reason the economies in all of the red states are suffering far less than those run by democrats, it has been that way for a long time, and the pandemic has done nothing but further widen the gap. Not completely sure what it will take for people to open their eyes.

                                                        Comment


                                                        • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

                                                          79% of the bill is either directly related to COVID, or tangentially related to COVID. 44% of the bill is direct aid to individuals. 9% is to help schools reopen as soon as possible. 18% is COVID aid to states and localities to help with vaccinations and other COVID related costs.

                                                          It does include some measures that aren't directly related to COVID. It is a budget and spending bill after all, and that's how it's being passed. For example, it includes a $300/kid monthly tax credit (that comes in the form of direct deposit checks) that will do more to end child poverty in this country than any piece of legislation passed in at least the past 20 years and is especially necessary given the impact of COVID on family structure // schools being closed. This is not a Democratic boondoggle, Mitt Romney was the first to propose a similar measure, and it's frankly amazing policy. If you want to criticize Democrat pork be my guest, but let's not pretend that only 10% of the bill has anything to do with COVID or that there isn't very good policy in it to help many Americans.
                                                          I won't argue the percentages, because it really depends on what one really considers COVID related. Your interpretation versus mine versus Polish Leppy versus the person writing the article are probably all different.

                                                          From the WSJ
                                                          The Wall Street Journal editorial board estimated that only $825 billion was directly related to Covid-19 relief and $1 trillion was “expansions of progressive programs, pork, and unrelated policy changes.”
                                                          My issue is throwing in the pork that isn't even closely related. Hard to justify most of what was posted above as COVID related.

                                                          Comment


                                                          • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                                                            I won't argue the percentages, because it really depends on what one really considers COVID related. Your interpretation versus mine versus Polish Leppy versus the person writing the article are probably all different.

                                                            From the WSJ


                                                            My issue is throwing in the pork that isn't even closely related. Hard to justify most of what was posted above as COVID related.
                                                            Yeah it depends on what we consider related.

                                                            The school stuff, to me, is not covid related. Any school that isn't open today is using covid as an excuse. I think we've known this for awhile. I dont think a single school will be open in August BECAUSE of this money.

                                                            Payments for pension plans, again, not covid.

                                                            Payments to state and local governments, eh... covid-y but a dumb idea.

                                                            Whether a lot of it is covid-related or not I suppose doesn't really matter. What does matter is its a shit ton of money and the pandemic is drawing to a close anyway. I understand needing to get people to the finish line, but a lot of this doesn't appear to be designed to do that.
                                                            Based Mullet Kid owns

                                                            Comment


                                                            • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                                                              I won't argue the percentages, because it really depends on what one really considers COVID related. Your interpretation versus mine versus Polish Leppy versus the person writing the article are probably all different.

                                                              From the WSJ


                                                              My issue is throwing in the pork that isn't even closely related. Hard to justify most of what was posted above as COVID related.
                                                              In the breakdown I saw, it was about $420 billion for projects and policy that has nothing to do with COVID. Whether it's a trillion dollars or $420 billion that's a lot of pork. Extremely fair to criticize every last penny of that.

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                                                              • Sadly, the Democrats know that the vast majority of people only care about the fact that they are getting a check. So it's packed with pork because they know there will be very little fall out.

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                                                                • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post
                                                                  Sadly, the Democrats know that the vast majority of people only care about the fact that they are getting a check. So it's packed with pork because they know there will be very little fall out.
                                                                  There could be a cure for Cancer in this bill but if there was no check it would have a very low approval rating. People are fickle and dumb and have been trained to depend on the government. A lot of "what can you do for me".

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                                                                  • Originally posted by Te'o4Heisman View Post

                                                                    Just imagine how many people it could help if it:
                                                                    A. Allocated ALL of the money that will be or already has come out of taxpayers pockets to helping people and addressing the consequences of the pandemic, rather than roughly 20% of it.
                                                                    B. Even if the money allocated to actual C19 relief efforts was the entire bill, it would cost Americans a whole lot less money than having us fund the billions of dollars in garbage in the bills that has nothing to do with the pandemic.
                                                                    People believe what they want to believe, facts be damned. There is a reason the economies in all of the red states are suffering far less than those run by democrats, it has been that way for a long time, and the pandemic has done nothing but further widen the gap. Not completely sure what it will take for people to open their eyes.
                                                                    I see you’ve found your Fox News talking point and your sticking to it. The truth is much more than 20% of this bill is being allocated in ways that will directly or indirectly put money in people’s pockets who need it. It’s being done in a variety of ways from stimulus checks to child tax credits to boosted unemployment benefits to shoring up pensions to saving jobs for police officers, firemen, airline workers, and small restaurants. The benefits will be spread far and wide unlike the GOP’s tax cut giveaway to the billionaire class.

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                                                                    • Anyone who thinks the COVID relief package is good as constructed should never advance further than running a lemonade stand. It will have subtle but terrible consequences across the country in the years to come.

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                                                                      • The black farmer reparations is an interesting thing to tack on to a COVID relief bill. Apparently, white farmers are doing fine and were the only recipients of earlier relief?

                                                                        https://www.foxnews.com/politics/far...-black-billion
                                                                        Running the damn ball since 2017.

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                                                                        • Originally posted by IrishRazor82 View Post
                                                                          Anyone who thinks the COVID relief package is good as constructed should never advance further than running a lemonade stand. It will have subtle but terrible consequences across the country in the years to come.
                                                                          Specifically what part will have terrible consequences?

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                                                                          • Originally posted by IrishLax View Post

                                                                            In the breakdown I saw, it was about $420 billion for projects and policy that has nothing to do with COVID. Whether it's a trillion dollars or $420 billion that's a lot of pork. Extremely fair to criticize every last penny of that.
                                                                            Yeah, I don't have a problem with the school funding, unemployment, etc.

                                                                            Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                            Specifically what part will have terrible consequences?
                                                                            Easy for a Canuck to say. It's our pocketbooks that will eventually pay for the fluff.

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                                                                            • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                                                                              Yeah, I don't have a problem with the school funding, unemployment, etc.



                                                                              Easy for a Canuck to say. It's our pocketbooks that will eventually pay for the fluff.
                                                                              Personally, liked your post listing out where some of the money was going. Wanted to see what specifically is making him upset. Never bet on the Democrats to get the optics right.

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                                                                              • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                                                                                The first and last ones listed are my favorites.
                                                                                • $1.5 million earmarked for the Seaway International Bridge, which connects New York to Canada. Senate Leader Chuck Schumer hails from New York.
                                                                                • $50 million for “family planning” – going to non-profits, i.e. Planned Parenthood, or public entities, including for “services for adolescents[.]”
                                                                                • $852 million for AmeriCorps, AmeriCorps Vista, and the National Senior Service Corps – the Corporation for National and Community Service – civic volunteer agencies. This includes $9 million for the AmeriCorp inspector general to conduct oversight and audits of the largess. AmeriCorps received a $1.1 billion FY2020 appropriation.
                                                                                • The Wall Street Journal editorial board estimated that only $825 billion was directly related to Covid-19 relief and $1 trillion was “expansions of progressive programs, pork, and unrelated policy changes.”

                                                                                  For example, separately, our auditors found that $470 million in the bill doubles the budgets of The Institute of Museum and Library Services and the National Endowment of the Arts and the Humanities.
                                                                                • $200 million in the bill to The Institute of Museum and Library Services (FY2019 budget: $230 million). This agency is so small that it doesn’t even employ an inspector general.
                                                                                • $270 million funds the National Endowment of the Arts and the Humanities (FY2019 budget: $253 million) – In 2017, our study showed eighty-percent of all non-profit grant making flowed to well-heeled organizations with over $1 million in assets.
                                                                                • $350 billion to bailout the 50 States and the District of Columbia. The allocation formula uses the unemployment rate in the fourth quarter of 2020. Therefore, states like New York and California –who had strict economic lockdown policies and high unemployment – will get bailout money. States like Florida and South Dakota – who were open for business – will get less.
                                                                                • $128.5 billion to fund K-12 education. The CBO determined that most of the money in education will be distributed in 2022 through 2028, when the pandemic is over.
                                                                                • $86 billion to save nearly 200 pension plans insured by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. There are no reforms mandated while these badly managed pensions are bailed-out. Many of these pension plans are co-managed by unions.
                                                                                • $50 billion goes to the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA). A portion of these funds is earmarked to reimburse up to $7,000 for funeral and burial costs related to Covid-19 deaths.
                                                                                • $39.6 billion to higher education. This amount is three times the money – $12.5 billion – that higher ed received with the massive CARES Act funding from last March.
                                                                                • $1.5 billion for Amtrak – the National Railroad Passenger Corporation. In FY2020, Congress appropriated $3 billion for Amtrak ($2 billion in annual appropriations, plus an additional $1 billion in the CARES Act COVID relief bill). In the three years before the pandemic, AMTRAK lost $392 million – even after a $5 billion taxpayer subsidy (FY2017-FY2019).
                                                                                • $50 million for environmental justice grants.Per Politifact, the bill appropriates to the Environmental Protection Agency $50 million for “grants, contracts and other agency activities that implement the environmental justice purposes and objectives” described in “Federal Actions to Address Environmental Justice in Minority Populations and Low-Income Populations,” an executive order signed by President Bill Clinton in 1994; and President Joe Biden’s “Tackling the Climate Crisis at Home and Abroad” executive order.
                                                                                • More than $100 million for an underground rail project in Silicon Valley. The bill allots $1.25 billion for federal transit capital investment grants.
                                                                                Republicans are evil because they didn't vote for the pork....err....COVID bill! They hate America!

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                                                                                • So much for Biden and other dems promising a $2k check if people voted for them to get them majority.

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                                                                                  • Originally posted by calvegas04 View Post
                                                                                    So much for Biden and other dems promising a $2k check if people voted for them to get them majority.
                                                                                    That's understandable, 'ol "Mush Brain" forgot months ago whatever he promised the American people!

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                                                                                    • Manchin seemed to suggest he won't be voting yes on anymore legislation without some Republicans also voting yes.

                                                                                      curious how that will pan out.
                                                                                      Based Mullet Kid owns

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                                                                                      • Originally posted by calvegas04 View Post
                                                                                        So much for Biden and other dems promising a $2k check if people voted for them to get them majority.
                                                                                        This is why not everyone should be allowed to vote
                                                                                        Prehistoric

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                                                                                        • BREAKING: Man with dementia forgets to golf every weekend, remembers to sign too many executive orders, opponents can't make up their minds.
                                                                                          It is no coincidence that the growth of modern tyrants has in every case been heralded by the growth of prejudice.

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                                                                                          • Originally posted by Rogue219 View Post
                                                                                            BREAKING: Man with dementia forgets to golf every weekend, remembers to sign too many executive orders, opponents can't make up their minds.
                                                                                            I get that optics are bad if presidents golf too much but its kinda dumb. Golf is fun and reminds us all how flawed we are lol.

                                                                                            regarding Biden: yeah its silly. Need to pick a lane or be more careful with word choice.

                                                                                            On one hand, this dude is clearly cooked and will sign whatever is put in front of him. On the other, he is adamant about not getting rid of the filibuster.

                                                                                            Hard to square these two.

                                                                                            Thought it was funny last night he said we'll be able to have small gatherings by the 4th of July. Lol. There are gonna be Uncle Sam themed orgies in even the most liberal enclaves of the country. People are getting vaccinated.

                                                                                            Based Mullet Kid owns

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                                                                                            • Originally posted by NorthDakota View Post

                                                                                              Thought it was funny last night he said we'll be able to have small gatherings by the 4th of July. Lol. There are gonna be Uncle Sam themed orgies in even the most liberal enclaves of the country. People are getting vaccinated.
                                                                                              Didn't watch, because we know what he was going to say.

                                                                                              1. More people than ever getting vaccinated.
                                                                                              2. Infection rates are continuing to decline.
                                                                                              3. By June or July everyone will have had an opportunity to get vaccinated.
                                                                                              4. Keep wearing a mask.
                                                                                              5. Together we'll beat this.

                                                                                              How close am I?

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                                                                                              • Originally posted by drayer54 View Post
                                                                                                The black farmer reparations is an interesting thing to tack on to a COVID relief bill. Apparently, white farmers are doing fine and were the only recipients of earlier relief?

                                                                                                https://www.foxnews.com/politics/far...-black-billion
                                                                                                They want to play the "race card" in order to get people to "accept it". If you object to it, then you're deemed racist. It's plain and simple.

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                                                                                                • It's still funny that Biden kept talking about having a plan to fight Covid during the campaign like he had some magic up his sleeve, and the plan is the same one the previous administration had: mask, distance, and vaccine. Biden is going to eventually raise a victory flag like it was his actions that beat Covid when in reality it was timing.

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                                                                                                  • Originally posted by ulukinatme View Post
                                                                                                    It's still funny that Biden kept talking about having a plan to fight Covid during the campaign like he had some magic up his sleeve, and the plan is the same one the previous administration had: mask, distance, and vaccine. Biden is going to eventually raise a victory flag like it was his actions that beat Covid when in reality it was timing.
                                                                                                    True, and years from now our public schools will teach children that Trump called Covid a hoax and the country was in peril until Biden was elected and delivered the vaccine.
                                                                                                    The yellow mustard pants are hideous and have to go.

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                                                                                                    • Originally posted by Polish Leppy 22 View Post

                                                                                                      True, and years from now our public schools will teach children that Trump called Covid a hoax and the country was in peril until Biden was elected and delivered the vaccine.
                                                                                                      Well one of these is true
                                                                                                      Prehistoric

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