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  • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

    I didnt mean to come off like you were some old rube lol. I meant that what is MAINSTREAM media really? Is truth mainstream? It implies that there is some argumentum ad populum is the driving force for truth when it cant because that is a logical fallacy.
    But I am!

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

      This is my understanding. Claiming it is valid is just untrue. I find it implausible there is an active campaign to suppress it except in the manner that our society would suppress recommending drinking bleach and standing in the sun as a valid treatment for COVID. There isnt a consensus by professionals or evidence enough to convince said professionals its a valid treatment at this time. If there were someone in the public sphere claiming drinking bleach would help treat COVID I'd expect all professionals to stand up and fight back on that until such time as evidence was presented that drinking bleach did in fact represent a viable tratment option.
      If you think about this logically, it would be almost impossible to keep this suppressed. You'd have to get thousands of people in health care, research, the government, advertising, pharma and all avenues of media to keep this quiet. How do you do that? Payoffs? That leaves an audit trail. All it takes is a whistleblower or two and it's exposed.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

        If you think about this logically, it would be almost impossible to keep this suppressed. You'd have to get thousands of people in health care, research, the government, advertising, pharma and all avenues of media to keep this quiet. How do you do that? Payoffs? That leaves an audit trail. All it takes is a whistleblower or two and it's exposed.
        Same thing could've been said about the suppression of the lab leak theory, but yet here we are.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

          If you think about this logically, it would be almost impossible to keep this suppressed. You'd have to get thousands of people in health care, research, the government, advertising, pharma and all avenues of media to keep this quiet. How do you do that? Payoffs? That leaves an audit trail. All it takes is a whistleblower or two and it's exposed.
          Right. To me it seem sthat the conspiracy buffs are taking the proffesional community's actions to not promote a currently unvalidated treatment as an active case of suppression. Again... if someone promoted bleach as a treatment for COVID Id full yexpect the prefessional community to stand up and actively disuade people from using it on a lack of evidence its a valid treatment and possible harm to the public. It would be irresponsible if they didnt. The "both sides" people look at it like its a active suppression campaign. How do you combat that in the realm of social and mainstream media?
          "From Chaos comes Clarity"

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post
            Id just like to clarify that there is a huge difference in not promoting something that has a lack of evidence and healthcare professionals not being willing to sign on to an unproven product versus the conspiracy theory that an unproven product is being actively suppressed. Sometime i t takes professionals time and additional evidence to convince them the product is doing what it says.

            This happens to me in my engineering line of work all the time. I am always being given new products that have claims of doing this or that and that I should start incorprating them in my building designs. Or new analysis methods or computer programs to use in design. It takes a hell of a LOT to convince me to use something when I know it can be life or death of people in the building. Id expect nothing less from healthcare professinoals regarding a medicine with an unproven track record.
            This has already happened months ago w/ remdesivir. While promising, there is scant hard evidence that it works in COVID-19 patients yet most patients who are hospitalized w/ C19, get remdesivir as part of their protocol. The WHO has stated that it is not a proven therapy for C19. It also costs approx $3,120 per patient w/ private insurance according to Catherine Thorbecke of ABC News.

            The guys that are promoting ivermectin the most are some of the leading ICU docs in the world. Roughly 20% of the patients that come to them in the ICU don’t survive so they know the importance of the Hippocratic Oath. Their speciality in pulmonary specific issues gives them even more credence to at least listen to what they have to say in regards to the evidence they present.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Irishize View Post

              This has already happened months ago w/ remdesivir. While promising, there is scant hard evidence that it works in COVID-19 patients yet most patients who are hospitalized w/ C19, get remdesivir as part of their protocol. The WHO has stated that it is not a proven therapy for C19. It also costs approx $3,120 per patient w/ private insurance according to Catherine Thorbecke of ABC News.

              The guys that are promoting ivermectin the most are some of the leading ICU docs in the world. Roughly 20% of the patients that come to them in the ICU don’t survive so they know the importance of the Hippocratic Oath. Their speciality in pulmonary specific issues gives them even more credence to at least listen to what they have to say in regards to the evidence they present.
              I get it. Im a structural engineer and if my work is subpar or I specify products that are subpar, hard to construct or worng... it can lead to deaths. I am super skeptical of anything that isnt well tested or effective and I am unlikely to approve anything that deviates from design after I have put my stamp on it. I am unmoved by this argument. If its effective then it can be shown but it takes time and it takes evidence to do so. If its effective it will be shown to be so and the professional community will come to accept it. The reason the mRNA vaccines came first was becasue the healthcare community had already shown their means and methods are effective but the mRNA vaccines were not previously approved by the FDA. These were esentially ready to go the moment the pandemic was in full swing minus getting it to work for COVID.

              Regarding remdesivir, it was already being used to treat RNA viral laods from the SARS and MERS family. The government agencies have been familiar with its devleopment for a while prior to COVID.

              THis is from a journal article:
              As the COVID-19 pandemic races across the globe, the scientific community, from academic and government laboratories to small biotechnology companies and multinational pharmaceutical corporations, has mobilized to develop and evaluate potential therapeutics and vaccines.101104 Repurposing or repositioning an effective small-molecule therapeutic promises to be the fastest therapeutic means to stem the tide of the pandemic.105,106 Among the candidate therapies, remdesivir has demonstrated efficacy in both in vitro and in vivo models against coronaviruses. Recently, through a compassionate use indication, remdesivir has supportive evidence for yielding some clinical improvement in COVID-19 patients.107 In addition, an interim analysis of the Adaptive COVID-19 Treatment Trial (NCT04280705) supports improvement in the primary endpoint for patients receiving remdesivir, compared to control, with a 31% faster time to recovery.108 Based on these initial findings, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration has issued an Emergency Use Authorization for the emergency use of remdesivir for the treatment of hospitalized COVID-19 patients. With no drug having FDA approval for marketing as a treatment for SARS-CoV-2, this is the first FDA authorization of an investigational therapeutic for use in treating SARS-CoV-2.109 While remdesivir represents one compound whose recent use authorization may, in part, mitigate the morbidity, mortality, and strain on global healthcare systems caused by COVID-19, additional ongoing clinical trials will provide much-needed clarity surrounding the repurposing of approved drugs and experimental agents against SARS-CoV-2.
              Essentially the reason it was approved for use was that it did show an ability to help and not harm.
              Last edited by Cackalacky2.0; 06-24-2021, 02:14 PM.
              "From Chaos comes Clarity"

              Comment


              • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post

                Same thing could've been said about the suppression of the lab leak theory, but yet here we are.
                Not quite. The suppression of that came primarily from China and the leaders of WHO, who were defending China right from the start. They weren't cooperating and allowing investigations from anyone else.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

                  I get it. Im a structural engineer and if my work is subpar or I specify products that are subpar, hard to construct or worng... it can lead to deaths. I am super skeptical of anything that isnt well tested or effective and I am unlikely to approve anything that deviates from design after I have put my stamp on it. I am unmoved by this argument. If its effective then it can be shown but it takes time and it takes evidence to do so. If its effective it will be shown to be so and the professional community will come to accept it. The reason the mRNA vaccines came first was becasue the healthcare community had already shown their means and methods are effective but the mRNA vaccines were not previously approved by the FDA. These were esentially ready to go the moment the pandemic was in full swing minus getting it to work for COVID.

                  Regarding remdesivir, it was already being used to treat RNA viral laods from the SARS and MERS family. The government agencies have been familiar with its devleopment for a while prior to COVID.

                  THis is from a journal article:
                  Yeah, I wouldn't want peoples deaths haunting me because I took a short cut or didn't properly vet the products and design.

                  WTH happened in Miami?

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                    If you think about this logically, it would be almost impossible to keep this suppressed. You'd have to get thousands of people in health care, research, the government, advertising, pharma and all avenues of media to keep this quiet. How do you do that? Payoffs? That leaves an audit trail. All it takes is a whistleblower or two and it's exposed.
                    You've spent more time arguing against a topic and video you don't have full awareness/context about. Just watch the video and welcome to the other side lol.

                    Every question or point you've brought up would be answered and you'd be able to provide another informed opinion on this all.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Irish#1 View Post

                      Yeah, I wouldn't want peoples deaths haunting me because I took a short cut or didn't properly vet the products and design.

                      WTH happened in Miami?
                      Unsure. It was an old build. Waiting get some more info. Doesn’t look good though
                      "From Chaos comes Clarity"

                      Comment


                      • For people still on the fence on getting vaccinated the delta variant is 100% more likely to land you in the hospital than alpha which is 25% more likely to lead to severe disease than the strain that hit New York. That would imply a 250% increase in mortality from our initial estimates. That's more than the risk becoming obese and developing poorly controlled diabetes adds to mortality/severe disease.

                        To add insult to injury a new variant of concern has popped up that is concerning for increased transmissibility, infectiousness, and ability to evade monoclonal antibody treatment.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by PerthDomer View Post
                          For people still on the fence on getting vaccinated the delta variant is 100% more likely to land you in the hospital than alpha which is 25% more likely to lead to severe disease than the strain that hit New York. That would imply a 250% increase in mortality from our initial estimates. That's more than the risk becoming obese and developing poorly controlled diabetes adds to mortality/severe disease.

                          To add insult to injury a new variant of concern has popped up that is concerning for increased transmissibility, infectiousness, and ability to evade monoclonal antibody treatment.
                          Good news for those of you who watched the video - Ivermectin doesn't give a F about variants. It attacks all COVID we're aware of thus far in every country.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by IrishRazor82 View Post

                            Good news for those of you who watched the video - Ivermectin doesn't give a F about variants. It attacks all COVID we're aware of thus far in every country.
                            The studies conducted appeared to be from August 2020, before the UK/Delta variants were out. Are there more studies done on the effectiveness against the variants?

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                              The studies conducted appeared to be from August 2020, before the UK/Delta variants were out. Are there more studies done on the effectiveness against the variants?
                              The guys on JRE said they believed Ivermectin would be effective against variants I think.
                              Based Mullet Kid owns

                              Comment


                              • You're right, ivermectin would be effective against all the variants at four times the toxic dose for human cells. Fortunately or unfortunately we don't have an effective way to pump levels that high without an IV.

                                Looking at it another way at current doses 0% efficacy is maintained against all variants.

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by PerthDomer View Post
                                  You're right, ivermectin would be effective against all the variants at four times the toxic dose for human cells. Fortunately or unfortunately we don't have an effective way to pump levels that high without an IV.

                                  Looking at it another way at current doses 0% efficacy is maintained against all variants.
                                  Haven’t really paid attention to dosages, but the podcast with Rohan Weinstein and Kory seemed to be referencing dosages that were not dramatically high

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post

                                    Haven’t really paid attention to dosages, but the podcast with Rohan Weinstein and Kory seemed to be referencing dosages that were not dramatically high
                                    Once a week dose and for the standard body (aka they didn't give fat people more which he admits they should).

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post

                                      Haven’t really paid attention to dosages, but the podcast with Rohan Weinstein and Kory seemed to be referencing dosages that were not dramatically high
                                      The reason most didn't think ivermectin to work is that the concentration that inhibits viral replication is a level that kills human cells. The RCT's performed on ivermectin have shown 0 impact. On the other hand YouTube seems to disagree so what do we really know.

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by IrishRazor82 View Post

                                        Once a week dose and for the standard body (aka they didn't give fat people more which he admits they should).
                                        We don't give higher ivermectin doses for parasitic infections to overweight patients. We also dose medications for ideal body weight for most medications. Why is Ivermectin different specifically when used for COVID? This is hydroxychloroquine on a smaller scale. First the trials were invalid because zinc wasn't used. Then we needed to add azithromycin. When a therapy bombs in trials we move on to other therapies. That's how medicine works.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by PerthDomer View Post
                                          For people still on the fence on getting vaccinated the delta variant is 100% more likely to land you in the hospital than alpha which is 25% more likely to lead to severe disease than the strain that hit New York. That would imply a 250% increase in mortality from our initial estimates. That's more than the risk becoming obese and developing poorly controlled diabetes adds to mortality/severe disease.

                                          To add insult to injury a new variant of concern has popped up that is concerning for increased transmissibility, infectiousness, and ability to evade monoclonal antibody treatment.
                                          This should be repeated daily in all states. Get the damn vax

                                          Comment


                                          • Hopefully the NIH will have a conclusion on ivermectin soon...

                                            Supporters tout anti-parasite drug as covid-19 treatment, but skeptics call it the ‘new hydroxychloroquine’

                                            An NIH trial may settle debate over ivermectin; officials warn people not to take animal formulation of the drug.


                                            https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...in-covid-drug/

                                            Comment


                                            • Peer reviewed study on the risk/benefit of COVID 19 Vaccines: https://www.mdpi.com/2076-393X/9/7/693/htm

                                              Conclusion: The present assessment raises the question whether it would be necessary to rethink policies and use COVID-19 vaccines more sparingly and with some discretion only in those that are willing to accept the risk because they feel more at risk from the true infection than the mock infection. Perhaps it might be necessary to dampen the enthusiasm by sober facts? In our view, the EMA and national authorities should instigate a safety review into the safety database of COVID-19 vaccines and governments should carefully consider their policies in light of these data. Ideally, independent scientists should carry out thorough case reviews of the very severe cases, so that there can be evidence-based recommendations on who is likely to benefit from a SARS-CoV2 vaccination and who is in danger of suffering from side effects. Currently, our estimates show that we have to accept four fatal and 16 serious side effects per 100,000 vaccinations in order to save the lives of 2–11 individuals per 100,000 vaccinations, placing risks and benefits on the same order of magnitude.


                                              Note - the long term risks cannot be captured at this time, that's a cross your fingers and pray.

                                              Comment


                                              • Promising

                                                https://m.theepochtimes.com/mkt_brea...mpression=true

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                                                • The vaccine reporting system (VAERS) has over 4,800 deaths following the COVID vaccines that have been reported. In the entire 31 year history of VAERS, there are only 5,000 vaccine related deaths. We essentially hit that in 6 months.

                                                  The vaccine has failed on a number of fronts. First it's passing the blood brain barrier and opening the central nervous system to pathogens. The spike protein also isn't staying at the local spot where it was hoped to and it's showing up floating around the body in autopsies which is just becoming known now. Clotting and vascular damage is also starting to show up.

                                                  Meanwhile, poor little cheap Ivermectin prevents COVID as effectively as vaccines, helps you if you actually get COVID, is far cheaper, and there is zero safety risk...

                                                  What are your politicians and media telling you or not telling you though?

                                                  Comment


                                                  • Zimbabwe the latest so say forget the "WHO" and CDC and go ahead and adopt Ivermectin.

                                                    https://trialsitenews.com/conflict-o...st-ivermectin/

                                                    Comment


                                                    • Originally posted by IrishRazor82 View Post
                                                      Peer reviewed study on the risk/benefit of COVID 19 Vaccines: https://www.mdpi.com/2076-393X/9/7/693/htm

                                                      Conclusion: The present assessment raises the question whether it would be necessary to rethink policies and use COVID-19 vaccines more sparingly and with some discretion only in those that are willing to accept the risk because they feel more at risk from the true infection than the mock infection. Perhaps it might be necessary to dampen the enthusiasm by sober facts? In our view, the EMA and national authorities should instigate a safety review into the safety database of COVID-19 vaccines and governments should carefully consider their policies in light of these data. Ideally, independent scientists should carry out thorough case reviews of the very severe cases, so that there can be evidence-based recommendations on who is likely to benefit from a SARS-CoV2 vaccination and who is in danger of suffering from side effects. Currently, our estimates show that we have to accept four fatal and 16 serious side effects per 100,000 vaccinations in order to save the lives of 2–11 individuals per 100,000 vaccinations, placing risks and benefits on the same order of magnitude.


                                                      Note - the long term risks cannot be captured at this time, that's a cross your fingers and pray.


                                                      100s of studies showing the opposite. Right on cue, razor nitpicks the contrary one off study.


                                                      Agreed, the data shows that the vaccine is doing exactly what is is supposed to be doing.



                                                      The vaccine reporting system (VAERS) has over 4,800 deaths following the COVID vaccines that have been reported. In the entire 31 year history of VAERS, there are only 5,000 vaccine related deaths. We essentially hit that in 6 months.

                                                      The vaccine has failed on a number of fronts. First it's passing the blood brain barrier and opening the central nervous system to pathogens. The spike protein also isn't staying at the local spot where it was hoped to and it's showing up floating around the body in autopsies which is just becoming known now. Clotting and vascular damage is also starting to show up.
                                                      You realize that anyone at any time can submit anything to VAERS right? It's a great tool that helped identify the bloodclots in JnJ. Unfortunately, it's been completely abused, weaponized, and misconstrued by antivaxxers like yourself. Additionally, did you expect the vaccine to stop death forever? Shocking that a max vaccination program targeting primarily elderly, there would be people that coincidentally died of unrelated causes.


                                                      Thanks to the vaccines, COVID is all but over in most of the country. Unfortunately states like Arkansas and Missouri are going to continue to have to deal with it for the foreseeable future.

                                                      Comment


                                                      • Originally posted by notredomer23 View Post






                                                        You realize that anyone at any time can submit anything to VAERS right? It's a great tool that helped identify the bloodclots in JnJ. Unfortunately, it's been completely abused, weaponized, and misconstrued by antivaxxers like yourself. Additionally, did you expect the vaccine to stop death forever? Shocking that a max vaccination program targeting primarily elderly, there would be people that coincidentally died of unrelated causes.


                                                        Thanks to the vaccines, COVID is all but over in most of the country. Unfortunately states like Arkansas and Missouri are going to continue to have to deal with it for the foreseeable future.
                                                        I am a neanderthal to interpreting most vaccine data, but the level's of efficacy in these vaccines are some of the best ever, right? I remember seeing a chart showing the popular vaccines lined up against these ones, and being shocked at how poor the flu shot is (maybe it's that darned socialized medicine!). How do you combat people who aren't taking any vaccines to tell them they should get one of the best ones ever created?


                                                        I, for one, prefer the world class medicine of Zimbabwe over the world's best doctors in the US.

                                                        Comment


                                                        • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                          I am a neanderthal to interpreting most vaccine data, but the level's of efficacy in these vaccines are some of the best ever, right? I remember seeing a chart showing the popular vaccines lined up against these ones, and being shocked at how poor the flu shot is (maybe it's that darned socialized medicine!). How do you combat people who aren't taking any vaccines to tell them they should get one of the best ones ever created?


                                                          I, for one, prefer the world class medicine of Zimbabwe over the world's best doctors in the US.
                                                          The reason people aren't taking the vaccine has nothing to do with efficacy. If Ivermectin truly works and can be used in tandem with vaccines to reach people and countries that either don't want to take the vaccine or don't have access to the vaccine, we have a much better chance of wiping COVID out. People just continuing to yell vaccines, vaccines, vaccines, isn't likely to move the needle at this point. Hopefully the new study will provide clarity to the Ivermectin discussion.

                                                          Comment


                                                          • Decent article on "why Americans arent getting vaccinated". Its literally those that fear institutions (Feds, CDC etc...???), fear or distrust of medical science and those that dont trust their own eyes. All in all not getting vaccinated will allow COVID and its variants a home and a chance to further evolve rapidly. Couple this with the behaviors of vaccianted/unvaccinated Americans and we have this:

                                                            Nearly all deaths from COVID now are in unvaccianted people.

                                                            Unvaccinated people are traveling to mostly southern lcoations for vacation travel. Primary destinations are densely populated cities.

                                                            Vaccinated people are trending to travel to places where vaccination rates are highest. Primary destinations are wide open locations and not densely populated.
                                                            "From Chaos comes Clarity"

                                                            Comment


                                                            • Originally posted by notredomer23 View Post




                                                              Thanks to the vaccines, COVID is all but over in most of the country. Unfortunately states like Arkansas and Missouri are going to continue to have to deal with it for the foreseeable future.

                                                              Not just a nickname baby, come on down! (but please be vaccinated)



                                                              images.png

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                                                              • Originally posted by Armyirish47 View Post


                                                                Not just a nickname baby, come on down! (but please be vaccinated)



                                                                images.png
                                                                This is so infuriating as an Arkansan. The lack of vaccinated folks is going to set us back and affect most of us as it pertains to our jobs and being able to perform them. Get the damn vax or COVID & its variants will be around for our lifetime and we will have to be vaccinated every year. The window is open to crush this virus but we continue to stand flat-footed.

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                                                                • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post

                                                                  The reason people aren't taking the vaccine has nothing to do with efficacy. If Ivermectin truly works and can be used in tandem with vaccines to reach people and countries that either don't want to take the vaccine or don't have access to the vaccine, we have a much better chance of wiping COVID out. People just continuing to yell vaccines, vaccines, vaccines, isn't likely to move the needle at this point. Hopefully the new study will provide clarity to the Ivermectin discussion.
                                                                  Right, but if you have an incredible amount of vaccine supply of the best vaccines in the world why would you not take that? Why wait for studies on something not designed specifically for COVID-19?

                                                                  Like, I'm hoping the ivermectin studies by credible people come back as statistically beneficial to fighting COVID, but in the long run it is absolutely not worth waiting to see if an anti-parasitic drug is somehow going to be better than the vaccines.

                                                                  A lot of people seem to be conflating this as a calcium in take type situation ie. calcium pills vs drinking more milk, this isn't that, not even close.

                                                                  Comment


                                                                  • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                    Right, but if you have an incredible amount of vaccine supply of the best vaccines in the world why would you not take that? Why wait for studies on something not designed specifically for COVID-19?

                                                                    Like, I'm hoping the ivermectin studies by credible people come back as statistically beneficial to fighting COVID, but in the long run it is absolutely not worth waiting to see if an anti-parasitic drug is somehow going to be better than the vaccines.
                                                                    A lot of people seem to be conflating this as a calcium in take type situation ie. calcium pills vs drinking more milk, this isn't that, not even close.
                                                                    This. mRNA vaccianes have been devloped for a long time prior to COVID but Feds were slow to pull trigger on allowing them. Now that we have real world data from all over the world Id say they are still the best form of vaccine. Ivemrectin is basically like how Viagra came about and just seem slike a money grab to me.
                                                                    "From Chaos comes Clarity"

                                                                    Comment


                                                                    • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                      Right, but if you have an incredible amount of vaccine supply of the best vaccines in the world why would you not take that? Why wait for studies on something not designed specifically for COVID-19?

                                                                      Like, I'm hoping the ivermectin studies by credible people come back as statistically beneficial to fighting COVID, but in the long run it is absolutely not worth waiting to see if an anti-parasitic drug is somehow going to be better than the vaccines.

                                                                      A lot of people seem to be conflating this as a calcium in take type situation ie. calcium pills vs drinking more milk, this isn't that, not even close.
                                                                      This is well said. Let the ivermectin data run its course and we can hopefully have another weapon to fight &/or prevent COVID 19. In the meantime, why wouldn’t you get the vaccine? This should be the one thing that most Americans can agree on…we want to return to normal. Imagine if we had this vaccine at the same point last year? I wonder if there would be as many folks (or the same folks) resisting it?

                                                                      Comment


                                                                      • Originally posted by Irishize View Post

                                                                        This is well said. Let the ivermectin data run its course and we can hopefully have another weapon to fight &/or prevent COVID 19. In the meantime, why wouldn’t you get the vaccine? This should be the one thing that most Americans can agree on…we want to return to normal. Imagine if we had this vaccine at the same point last year? I wonder if there would be as many folks (or the same folks) resisting it?
                                                                        Amen brother. Hopefully they can kick it into gear in your state. Appreciate being on the same side for once lol.

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                                                                        • Originally posted by Irishize View Post

                                                                          This is well said. Let the ivermectin data run its course and we can hopefully have another weapon to fight &/or prevent COVID 19. In the meantime, why wouldn’t you get the vaccine? This should be the one thing that most Americans can agree on…we want to return to normal. Imagine if we had this vaccine at the same point last year? I wonder if there would be as many folks (or the same folks) resisting it?
                                                                          The people resisting it are really just resisting it becasue someone is essentially telling them they should take the vaccine after Dear Leader Cheetolini spent the entire pandemic conditioning them and grifting on them. They wont do it just becasue the FED is pushing it and they hate the FED and it wont only be a political vidctory for Biden but a moral victory for the educated. #AmericaFuckYeah
                                                                          "From Chaos comes Clarity"

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                                                                          • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post
                                                                            This. mRNA vaccianes have been devloped for a long time prior to COVID but Feds were slow to pull trigger on allowing them. Now that we have real world data from all over the world Id say they are still the best form of vaccine. Ivemrectin is basically like how Viagra came about and just seem slike a money grab to me.
                                                                            Feels kinda like when I had the flu growing up and couldn't swallow any meds to help with the symptoms so I would just drink flat ginger ale for minimal relief. Instead this time it's an anti-parasitic daily (probably not great on the kidneys) for possible/unproven benefits.

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                                                                            • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

                                                                              The people resisting it are really just resisting it becasue someone is essentially telling them they should take the vaccine after Dear Leader Cheetolini spent the entire pandemic conditioning them and grifting on them. They wont do it just becasue the FED is pushing it and they hate the FED and it wont only be a political vidctory for Biden but a moral victory for the educated. #AmericaFuckYeah
                                                                              Is it really that? I thought the HCQ stuff was snake oil stuff but once the vaccine was in development/close to being out wasn't their a huge hype train for that from GOP/Dems? Is the divide really that large? Thought the messaging was "masks are bunk, and vaccines will be the only thing to help us"

                                                                              Comment


                                                                              • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                                Amen brother. Hopefully they can kick it into gear in your state. Appreciate being on the same side for once lol.
                                                                                Bro, I just spent a long weekend w/ my buddies from college where we play golf, drink/eat & fellowship. I was disappointed to see most of my bros are split down the middle politically. The vaccine was obviously one of the topics. Very few shared nuanced views or were open-minded. There were the staunch Republicans and the staunch Dems. I give them credit for having respectful debate and “agreeing to disagree” but until we start realizing that we all have much more in common vs what we disagree on, the nation will remain deadlocked w/ Team A vs Team B. This was a microcosm of what we see nationally.

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                                                                                • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post
                                                                                  Ivemrectin is basically like how Viagra came about and just seem slike a money grab to me.
                                                                                  Interesting. Why do you think Ivermectin is a money grab?

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                                                                                  • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                                    Is it really that? I thought the HCQ stuff was snake oil stuff but once the vaccine was in development/close to being out wasn't their a huge hype train for that from GOP/Dems? Is the divide really that large? Thought the messaging was "masks are bunk, and vaccines will be the only thing to help us"
                                                                                    IMO yes. Look at the percentages and geographical distribution of the unvaccinated.
                                                                                    "From Chaos comes Clarity"

                                                                                    Comment


                                                                                    • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                                      Is it really that? I thought the HCQ stuff was snake oil stuff but once the vaccine was in development/close to being out wasn't their a huge hype train for that from GOP/Dems? Is the divide really that large? Thought the messaging was "masks are bunk, and vaccines will be the only thing to help us"
                                                                                      Nope. There is a big variety of reasons people haven't gotten it. But it serves his narrative to make this some Ruby Ridge thing lolol.
                                                                                      Based Mullet Kid owns

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                                                                                      • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

                                                                                        IMO yes. Look at the percentages and geographical distribution of the unvaccinated.
                                                                                        Gotcha, usually ideologically between our countries we trend the same way and my conservative friends are all on the Vax train. Conceptually you would think someone (Trump) who championed their ability to get the Vax out to the world so fast would have got a ton of buy in from his supporters. But I guess being anti-vax is something that pre-dates Donald.

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                                                                                        • Nobody is making money off of Ivermectin. That's the reason it's not being pushed, that's the reason there have been no large studies. The large studies are expensive, and usually paid for by pharmaceutical companies. They can't make any money off of it, so no large studies are done. Instead the Feds are pumping 3.2 billion in search of some drug that can do what Ivermectin is claimed to do.

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                                                                                          • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post
                                                                                            Nobody is making money off of Ivermectin. That's the reason it's not being pushed, that's the reason there have been no large studies. The large studies are expensive, and usually paid for by pharmaceutical companies. They can't make any money off of it, so no large studies are done. Instead the Feds are pumping 3.2 billion in search of some drug that can do what Ivermectin is claimed to do.
                                                                                            Viagra was only a blood pressure medicine at first. Side effects included causing erections within 30-60 minutes. The drug then became appoved for impotence becasue Pfizer saw this to be the better way to make money off it. If there is money to be made off a drug by repurposing it....it will.

                                                                                            I guess im confused because I keep hearing that it has all these valid studies (which it doesnt) and if it becomes approved it will reap a windfall by becoming part of any COVID treatment thereby being repurposed from its original development intent. But im also hearing the community is actively denying it. Intersting dynamic for sure.
                                                                                            "From Chaos comes Clarity"

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                                                                                            • Originally posted by TorontoGold View Post

                                                                                              Gotcha, usually ideologically between our countries we trend the same way and my conservative friends are all on the Vax train. Conceptually you would think someone (Trump) who championed their ability to get the Vax out to the world so fast would have got a ton of buy in from his supporters. But I guess being anti-vax is something that pre-dates Donald.

                                                                                              Its almost an r=0.9 coorelation lmao

                                                                                              I also do not lump anti-covid vaxers in with the pre-Trump mumps, measles, Diptet causes autism antivaxxers. Two distinct POVs and rationale IMO. That group has been out to lunch on that for a while. I wont give them an ounce of oxygen to breath. Problem is that the anti-covid vaccinators are attempting to assimilate similar arguments into their beliefs but its incoherent.
                                                                                              "From Chaos comes Clarity"

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                                                                                              • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

                                                                                                Viagra was only a blood pressure medicine at first. Side effects included causing erections within 30-60 minutes. The drug then became appoved for impotence becasue Pfeizer saw this to be the better way ot make money off it. If ther eis money to be made off a drug by repurposing it it will.

                                                                                                I guess im confused becasue I keep hearing tha tit has all this valid studies (which it doesnt) and if it becomes approved it will reap a windfall by becoming part of any COVID treatment therby being repruposed from its original development intent. But im also hearing the community is actively denying it. Intersting dynamic for sure.
                                                                                                That's because Pfizer had a patent. The patent for Ivermectin's patent has long been expired and thus no money to be made since literally anyone could produce it.

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                                                                                                • Originally posted by ab2cmiller View Post

                                                                                                  That's because Pfizer had a patent. The patent for Ivermectin's patent has long been expired and thus no money to be made since literally anyone could produce it.
                                                                                                  It can be repurposed and repatented yes?
                                                                                                  "From Chaos comes Clarity"

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                                                                                                  • Originally posted by Cackalacky2.0 View Post

                                                                                                    It can be repurposed and repatented yes?
                                                                                                    I suppose, but if they are testing a version that is the same as all of the current generics, not sure why anyone would pay for a more expensive version that has been repanteted. Bottom line is I've never read any articles with anyone theorizing that Ivermectin is a potential money grab. Now the 3.2 billion that the Feds are ready to throw out there, that's a different story.

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