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  • "Life" for LSD.....

    Sentenced to life in prison, man pins hopes on new clemency rules - CNN.com

    I'm not at all endorsing drug use or sales, but holy crap batman. Murderers get out in 10 years these days. I like hard core sentencing for some things (murder, rape, etc.) but this is just shameful. Not to mention a burden to taxpayers.
    The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down
    Of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee

  • #2
    Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
    Sentenced to life in prison, man pins hopes on new clemency rules - CNN.com

    I'm not at all endorsing drug use or sales, but holy crap batman. Murderers get out in 10 years these days. I like hard core sentencing for some things (murder, rape, etc.) but this is just shameful. Not to mention a burden to taxpayers.
    Unreal. The dude was 23 years old and lost his entire future off of selling some LSD?

    How is that possible in today's age?

    Good point on the waste of taxpayer money as well. Totally agree.
    Originally posted by koonja
    I'm making peace with Woolly in 2017.

    Comment


    • #3
      Damn that's excessive. I'm all for locking up drug dealers for an appropriate amount of time, but this guy doesn't deserve life in prison. He deserves time for sure, but he's already served that and then some.
      60% of the time, it works every time.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Irishnuke View Post
        Damn that's excessive. I'm all for locking up drug dealers for an appropriate amount of time, but this guy doesn't deserve life in prison. He deserves time for sure, but he's already served that and then some.


        LOCK HIM THE FUCK UP!

        Or, use the information on how harmful drugs are to make a reasonable decision:

        Last edited by Buster Bluth; 04-26-2014, 06:48 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          It's hard to feel sorry for drug dealers. And this guy was doing so much with his life being 23 and following the grateful dead around while on acid and selling it. But yeah, it certainly is excessive. I have a libertarian view when it comes to drugs. Legalize them and treat them like alcohol and 80% of crime is eliminated.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post


            LOCK HIM THE FUCK UP!

            Or, use the information on how harmful drugs are to make a reasonable decision:

            Sure. Let him keep dealing. It always works out for those guys.
            60% of the time, it works every time.

            Comment


            • #7
              I had to look up qat. Never heard of it before.

              Comment


              • #8
                I'd say 2-10 years is fair for a first time dealer depending on the amount. Anything more is excessive IMO. I personally don't want my hard earned tax dollars going to feed and shelter this guy. Hell I've seen rapist, murders, armed robbers, etc. get less. F'ing ridiculous. I wonder how many there are like him?
                The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down
                Of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                  I'd say 2-10 years is fair for a first time dealer depending on the amount.
                  ...based on? You think someone giving LSD to their friend should get them 2-10 years in prison?! Do you even know how harmless LSD is? Did you look at the graph??

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                    ...based on? You think someone giving LSD to their friend should get them 2-10 years in prison?! Do you even know how harmless LSD is? Did you look at the graph??
                    Not giving to a friend, dealing. Big difference. If you 100+ hits, you're not giving anything to a friend. I'd consider that (giving to a friend) possession or something less than distribution. May not be the legal definition but IMO it should be.

                    Also, "based on"... Based on how I feel. Harmless or not, true dealing, regardless "what" should get time. If it's illegal, it's illegal. If laws are changed, their changed. I've always been for the legalization of pot, but I also knew it was against the law, and what happens if I, or others broke the law. If you take a calculated risk and lose, whose fault is that.

                    Now the above was illegal. He deserved some time. He didn't deserve life...
                    All my opinion.
                    The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down
                    Of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                      Not giving to a friend, dealing. Big difference.
                      Giving to a friend is dealing. Shit, simply having more than X amount (for cannabis it's usually an once) is dealing.

                      Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                      If you 100+ hits, you're not giving anything to a friend. I'd consider that (giving to a friend) possession or something less than distribution. May not be the legal definition but IMO it should be.

                      Also, "based on"... Based on how I feel. Harmless or not, true dealing, regardless "what" should get time. If it's illegal, it's illegal. If laws are changed, their changed. I've always been for the legalization of pot, but I also knew it was against the law, and what happens if I, or others broke the law. If you take a calculated risk and lose, whose fault is that.
                      In two paragraphs you have both "if it's illegal, it's illegal" and "may not be the legal definition but IMO it should be."

                      Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                      If you take a calculated risk and lose, whose fault is that.
                      Not directed at you, but I think there is a certain amount of blame for men who don't have the balls to stand up and shout "don't throw someone in jail for this!" I proudly voted against every felony cannabis charge that I came across when I served on a grand jury.

                      Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                      Now the above was illegal. He deserved some time. He didn't deserve life...
                      All my opinion.
                      And in your opinion someone should get ten years for dealing. That's just plain fucked up. Fucked up in that you think you have the authority over what two other adults decide to do to themselves with relative harmless substances, and fucked up that you don't consider the effects of locking them up for a decade. Ten years?!? that basically is life. There is rarely a comeback story from that amount of time behind bars.

                      What should pharmaceutical companies get for giving us artificial drugs that kill tens of thousands annually and serve as the largest gateway to heroin use? Oh nevermind, that's legal. They get paychecks, LSD and such get prison. Makes total sense.
                      Last edited by Buster Bluth; 04-27-2014, 01:10 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post


                        I think there is a certain amount of blame for men who don't have the balls to stand up and shout "don't throw someone in jail this!" I proudly voted against every felony cannabis charge that I came across when I served on a grand jury.

                        = Jury nullification.
                        "And then secondly, it's just very, very pleasant. I mean, very pleasant." - Gary Johnson

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Drug sentencing is way way out of hand. Minimum mandatory sentencing laws are complete horse crap. This particular case is just total shit!

                          1 - We should legalize marijuana

                          2 - Drug sentencing for drugs still deemed by society too dangerous to be legalized should not be years it should be days/months. If not completely decriminalized or just a fine for just usage.

                          3 - Start treating drug addiction as a healthcare issue not a criminal issue.

                          Drug sentencing has destroyed lives. It has destroyed families. I think our inner cities would be in much much better shape if not for decades of the war on drugs breaking up and destroying families and ruining lives.
                          That and addressing teenage pregnancies which is another issue.
                          Last edited by chicago51; 04-26-2014, 10:53 PM.
                          TEAM = Together Everyone Achieves More

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I have yet to see a good reason for things like ecstasy, LSD, and mushrooms to be illegal for adults. I think it should be illegal, even felonious, to give to a minor, but I don't think adults should have to suffer legal consequences for possessing those things.

                            I can see the merits of an argument that say we should regulate LSD and mushrooms, maybe have state-licensed LSD/shroom shops with basically certified chaperones. Much like you'd go visit a casino, or check into a hotel...you book a trip to the LSD center and they give you a regulated dose and you fucking see the universe like you've never seen it before.

                            But to ban nonaddictive substances that you can't OD on...come on. That's just dumb. Throwing people in prison for "2-10 years" for selling it...now I'm just pissed.
                            Last edited by Buster Bluth; 04-27-2014, 12:09 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                              I have yet to see a good reason for things like ecstasy, LSD, and mushrooms to be illegal for adults. I think it should be illegal, even felonious, to give to a minor, but I don't think adults should have to suffer legal consequences for possessing those things.

                              I can see the merits of an argument that say we should regulate LSD and mushrooms, maybe have state-licensed LSD/shroom shops with basically certified chaperones. Much like you'd go visit a casino, or check into a hotel...you book a trip to the LSD center and they give you a regulated dose and you fucking see the universe like you've never seen it before.

                              But to ban nonaddictive substances that you can't OD on...come on. That's just dumb. Throwing people in prison for "2-10 years" for selling it...now I'm just pissed.
                              "And then secondly, it's just very, very pleasant. I mean, very pleasant." - Gary Johnson

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Something that I think some people may have missed in the CNN article linked in the OP is that this was Timothy Tyler's third offense, not his first. He had been given probation in his first two, and then he pleaded guilty to a third offense to protect his dad, not realizing that the mandatory federal sentencing guidelines required the court to give him a life sentence for that third offense.

                                Not that that necessarily makes it any better. "Three strikes" recidivism enhancements like that may not be unconstitutional (Narrow Supreme Court Decision Upholds "Three Strike" Law) but they have been heavily criticized. There is no way it makes sense to give a guy a life sentence for even three convictions for selling LSD to concertgoers.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Jebediah Springfield View Post
                                  nah man:

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Meh. He shouldn't get life, but I'm not going to give two shits about a drug dealer on this third offense. Personally, there are injustices in this world for good people (especially children) that are far more deserving for our sympathy/empathy/call-to-action than a convicted drug dealer. Call me callous, call me insensitive, call me maybe, but that's how I feel personally.

                                    Originally posted by chicago51 View Post
                                    Drug sentencing has destroyed lives. It has destroyed families. I think our inner cities would be in much much better shape if not for decades of the war on drugs breaking up and destroying families and ruining lives.
                                    Hard core drug use has destroyed many more lives and many more families than drug sentencing. I worked in the inner city for almost 20 years, and while the war on drugs was a political joke, the drug users and the actions of the drug users and drug dealers destroyed more families than the war on drugs did.
                                    sigpic Silence implies consent.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Sentences for dealers versus users. There should be a difference. I think life was too harsh for this guy, but maybe if he had served a couple of years for the second offense he might have woken up instead of continuing to deal.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                                        I'd say 2-10 years is fair for a first time dealer depending on the amount. Anything more is excessive IMO. I personally don't want my hard earned tax dollars going to feed and shelter this guy. Hell I've seen rapist, murders, armed robbers, etc. get less. F'ing ridiculous. I wonder how many there are like him?
                                        You don't think your tax dollars where already paying for his food and housing when he wasn't in prison?

                                        Comment


                                        • #21
                                          Originally posted by GATTACA! View Post
                                          You don't think your tax dollars where already paying for his food and housing when he wasn't in prison?
                                          On what basis did you deduce that?

                                          Comment


                                          • #22
                                            Do you all think this guy's story is more sympathetic/garnering more attention because he is white?

                                            Honest question.

                                            Comment


                                            • #23
                                              Originally posted by magogian View Post
                                              Do you all think this guy's story is more sympathetic/garnering more attention because he is white?

                                              Honest question.
                                              I betů

                                              Originally posted by koonja
                                              I'm making peace with Woolly in 2017.

                                              Comment


                                              • #24
                                                Originally posted by NDinL.A. View Post
                                                Hard core drug use has destroyed many more lives and many more families than drug sentencing. I worked in the inner city for almost 20 years, and while the war on drugs was a political joke, the drug users and the actions of the drug users and drug dealers destroyed more families than the war on drugs did.
                                                Not that I disagree with the fact that some drug use can destroy lives, but when you say this have you really taken into account the full extent that the War on Drugs has affected lives? Even with respect to individual drug use, I would argue that forcing drug users underground and into the black market, a focus on incarceration instead of treatment, and entirely ignorant and misinformed drug education programs play a huge role in the affect that drug use has on society. I don't think we know how many fewer lives would be negatively affected by drugs if we had a sensible drug policy in this country so I would reserve judgment until then, although I suspect it would be a great help.

                                                As for the drug dealers...would they even exist if not for the War on Drugs?

                                                Comment


                                                • #25
                                                  Originally posted by magogian View Post
                                                  Do you all think this guy's story is more sympathetic/garnering more attention because he is white?

                                                  Honest question.
                                                  Yes.

                                                  How many of these cases have we heard about?

                                                  The ACLU estimates that, of the 3,278 serving life without parole for nonviolent offenses, 65 percent are Black, 18 percent are white, and 16 percent are Latino, evidence of extreme racial disparities. Of the 3,278, most were sentenced under mandatory sentencing policies, including mandatory minimums and habitual offender laws that required them to be incarcerated until they die.

                                                  Of the 3,278 prisoners , 79 percent were convicted of nonviolent, drug-related crimes such as possession or distribution, and 20 percent of nonviolent property crimes like theft.

                                                  https://www.aclu.org/criminal-law-re...ses-finds-aclu

                                                  Comment


                                                  • #26
                                                    Originally posted by GATTACA! View Post
                                                    You don't think your tax dollars where already paying for his food and housing when he wasn't in prison?
                                                    What does this mean?

                                                    Comment


                                                    • #27
                                                      Originally posted by GoIrish41 View Post
                                                      What does this mean?
                                                      That it is likely this guy was on the government dole prior to prison. So, the "cost" of prison is: the cost of prison minus the government benefits he received prior to prison.

                                                      Comment


                                                      • #28
                                                        Originally posted by magogian View Post
                                                        That it is likely this guy was on the government dole prior to prison. So, the "cost" of prison is: the cost of prison minus the government benefits he received prior to prison.
                                                        It's rather outrageous to make that assumption.

                                                        Comment


                                                        • #29
                                                          Originally posted by magogian View Post
                                                          That it is likely this guy was on the government dole prior to prison. So, the "cost" of prison is: the cost of prison minus the government benefits he received prior to prison.
                                                          Oh, so it was every bit the stupid assumption that it appeared to be. Thanks for the clarification.

                                                          Comment


                                                          • #30
                                                            Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                                                            Giving to a friend is dealing. Shit, simply having more than X amount (for cannabis it's usually an once) is dealing.



                                                            In two paragraphs you have both "if it's illegal, it's illegal" and "may not be the legal definition but IMO it should be."



                                                            Not directed at you, but I think there is a certain amount of blame for men who don't have the balls to stand up and shout "don't throw someone in jail for this!" I proudly voted against every felony cannabis charge that I came across when I served on a grand jury.



                                                            And in your opinion someone should get ten years for dealing. That's just plain fucked up. Fucked up in that you think you have the authority over what two other adults decide to do to themselves with relative harmless substances, and fucked up that you don't consider the effects of locking them up for a decade. Ten years?!? that basically is life. There is rarely a comeback story from that amount of time behind bars.

                                                            What should pharmaceutical companies get for giving us artificial drugs that kill tens of thousands annually and serve as the largest gateway to heroin use? Oh nevermind, that's legal. They get paychecks, LSD and such get prison. Makes total sense.
                                                            You have your liberal opinion, I have mine. Also, you misread my post (first comment you made) and made assumptions that I want to give every first time dealer 10 years. Take a chill pill (or whatever substance you feel necessary).
                                                            The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down
                                                            Of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee

                                                            Comment


                                                            • #31

                                                              Comment


                                                              • #32
                                                                Lol, why is Gattaca's assumption outrageous or stupid?

                                                                This guy appears to be a small time dealer, i.e. a low income individual. Low income individuals typically receive far more in government benefits than they pay in taxes. So, although his assumption may ultimately be wrong, but it is a very fair assumption without knowing the particulars.

                                                                Does it conflict with your fantasies that small time dealers and users of hard drugs are just a bunch of wonderful, ordinary folks with good, steady jobs that, if not for the war on drugs, would all be model citizens?
                                                                Last edited by magogian; 04-27-2014, 12:22 PM.

                                                                Comment


                                                                • #33
                                                                  Originally posted by chicago51 View Post
                                                                  Drug sentencing is way way out of hand. Minimum mandatory sentencing laws are complete horse crap. This particular case is just total shit!

                                                                  1 - We should legalize marijuana

                                                                  2 - Drug sentencing for drugs still deemed by society too dangerous to be legalized should not be years it should be days/months. If not completely decriminalized or just a fine for just usage.

                                                                  3 - Start treating drug addiction as a healthcare issue not a criminal issue.

                                                                  Drug sentencing has destroyed lives. It has destroyed families. I think our inner cities would be in much much better shape if not for decades of the war on drugs breaking up and destroying families and ruining lives.
                                                                  That and addressing teenage pregnancies which is another issue.
                                                                  I'm a detective in one of the worst, if not the worst, cities in the country. I don't know about the LSD guys case but I do know a lot about drug distributing organizations, sentencing, and what REALLY destroys families with drug addicts.

                                                                  1. You're missing the totality of what you read when you see a individual sentenced to 15-20 years for distribution. (Which rarely happens btw most 1-2nd offenders get months). A heroin, cocaine, crack, meth...etc distribution ring (even marijuana) almost always has homicides and other forms of sickening violence associated with it. Territory is at a premium and a lot of people die for it. Now the hard part in investigating is pinning bodies on 1 person with full proof evidence to convict. So the state uses drug sentencing laws as a way to stop the reign of terror that comes down on communities from these organizations.

                                                                  2. Min sentencing requirements offer crucial leverage to compel cooperation. Without it my job becomes much more difficult.

                                                                  3. Drug sentencing does not destroy families of drug addicts. What destroys families is the stealing, lying, failing out of rehab, disappearing for weeks at a time with the family not knowing if their loved one is dead or alive, and the cost that bankrupts families trying to get the addict help over the countless times he quits rehab, stops taking his medicine, and relapses. In fact, from my experience, most families prefer their addicted love one in jail bc they know they're alive and (supposedly) clean. Addicts have to want to get clean and by want they have to do more than talk about it. There's countless low cost programs available for addicts to help them and they quit the program. Sadly, after these battles that last 5-10-15 years the families are actually relieved and at peace bc they can move forward with their lives.

                                                                  I know my opinion is not politically correct but the academics who have been in college for 20+ years need to get into the gutter and really open their eyes to what the issues actually are. Stats can be quoted endlessly but everyday I see a reality that doesn't quite add up to what the studies, stats...etc would like you to believe . Btw when I respectfully present my experience to my graduate professors I'm told that I'm either not qualified to have an opinion bc I don't have a PhD or I'm just wrong and told that My experiences don't happen. Meanwhile the professor who has spent 20 years doin nothing but teaching at a cushy elite college campus is right?

                                                                  Sorry for my rant but I believe that in order to fix the problem it has to be correctly understood

                                                                  Comment


                                                                  • #34
                                                                    Originally posted by NDinL.A. View Post
                                                                    Meh. He shouldn't get life, but I'm not going to give two shits about a drug dealer on this third offense. Personally, there are injustices in this world for good people (especially children) that are far more deserving for our sympathy/empathy/call-to-action than a convicted drug dealer. Call me callous, call me insensitive, call me maybe, but that's how I feel personally.



                                                                    Hard core drug use has destroyed many more lives and many more families than drug sentencing. I worked in the inner city for almost 20 years, and while the war on drugs was a political joke, the drug users and the actions of the drug users and drug dealers destroyed more families than the war on drugs did.
                                                                    I think that's a fair point that deserves to be taken seriously.

                                                                    My boss came up in juvenile court and he wanted me and my co-workers to tour the local juvenile courts building to get a sense of what goes on there. One of the abuse-and-neglect judges I got a chance to speak with said something similar to what Hollywood posted. Basically, he said, there are a lot of people out there who want to legalize drugs and he understands all that, but he has a different perspective on the issue, because he has seen how drugs make people completely forget about their own children. And that's if the kids are almost lucky ... sometimes drugs turn parents into people who actively harm their own children.

                                                                    Just fwiw. It definitely made me think twice about the issue.

                                                                    Comment


                                                                    • #35
                                                                      Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                                                                      It's rather outrageous to make that assumption.
                                                                      But you don't think it's outrageous to bring some nebulous chart about the "harm" of different drugs, based on information from the U.K., to a discussion about drug issues in America. Oh, and keep in mind that there is absolutely NO way for anyone here to see what criteria were used, to develop this "harm" chart.

                                                                      Comment


                                                                      • #36
                                                                        Originally posted by NDinL.A. View Post
                                                                        Meh. He shouldn't get life, but I'm not going to give two shits about a drug dealer on this third offense. Personally, there are injustices in this world for good people (especially children) that are far more deserving for our sympathy/empathy/call-to-action than a convicted drug dealer. Call me callous, call me insensitive, call me maybe, but that's how I feel personally.
                                                                        He was in his early twenties and his two previous charges had landed him only probation. Think about the message that sends to him as a young kid. 1st time: Mild hand slap, don't do this, it's not that serious but don't do it ok? 2nd time: Caught you again, mild hand slap, don't do it, not very serious, nothing that can get you real time, but don't do it. 3rd time: You will never be a free man again, you will die in prison. Any time that something isn't murder or rape, and the first day you spend in jail is the beginning of a life sentence, something is wrong.

                                                                        I also disagree with your concept of "good people" necessarily excluding any person with a drug charge on their record, but that's more of a personal, empathy thing.

                                                                        Funnier than you in 2012.

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                                                                        • #37
                                                                          Originally posted by NDinL.A. View Post
                                                                          Meh. He shouldn't get life, but I'm not going to give two shits about a drug dealer on this third offense. Personally, there are injustices in this world for good people (especially children) that are far more deserving for our sympathy/empathy/call-to-action than a convicted drug dealer. Call me callous, call me insensitive, call me maybe, but that's how I feel personally.
                                                                          Is there are limit on how much sympathy/empathy we can have?

                                                                          Originally posted by NDinL.A. View Post
                                                                          Hard core drug use has destroyed many more lives and many more families than drug sentencing. I worked in the inner city for almost 20 years, and while the war on drugs was a political joke, the drug users and the actions of the drug users and drug dealers destroyed more families than the war on drugs did.
                                                                          You'd have to define what a hard core drug is. Meth? Heroin? Cocaine? Yep, in total agreement.

                                                                          Alcoholism and just plain alcohol has destroyed many more lives and families than those combined.

                                                                          I watched my father die when I was ten from decades of smoking cigarettes, does that count?

                                                                          Show me some stats showing families being destroyed and millions of lives being ruined by substances like ecstacy/LSD/mushrooms.

                                                                          Comment


                                                                          • #38
                                                                            Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                                                                            Is there are limit on how much sympathy/empathy we can have?
                                                                            I actually thought about this after my response above. It's not like me being empathetic/outraged at the injustice here somehow means I can't give it to a kid who deserves it later. "Sorry kid, I already used up my sympathetic points today. Come back later."

                                                                            Funnier than you in 2012.

                                                                            Comment


                                                                            • #39
                                                                              Originally posted by kmoose View Post
                                                                              But you don't think it's outrageous to bring some nebulous chart about the "harm" of different drugs, based on information from the U.K., to a discussion about drug issues in America. Oh, and keep in mind that there is absolutely NO way for anyone here to see what criteria were used, to develop this "harm" chart.
                                                                              Those god damn English and their stupid drug research!!

                                                                              Open up the ol' Google machine and see for yourself. The Swiss (Ew Europeans!) just concluded the first study of LSD in forty years, take a look.

                                                                              Comment


                                                                              • #40
                                                                                Originally posted by magogian View Post
                                                                                Lol, why is Gattaca's assumption outrageous or stupid?

                                                                                This guy appears to be a small time dealer, i.e. a low income individual. Low income individuals typically receive far more in government benefits than they pay in taxes. So, although his assumption may ultimately be wrong, but it is a very fair assumption without knowing the particulars.
                                                                                So basically you don't know shit about the guy. Is that what I'm reading?

                                                                                Originally posted by magogian View Post
                                                                                Does it conflict with your fantasies that small time dealers and users of hard drugs are just a bunch of wonderful, ordinary folks with good, steady jobs that, if not for the war on drugs, would all be model citizens?
                                                                                I think it conflicts with your fantasies that most dealers walked straight out of The Wire. There are certainly plenty of bad people out there, and plenty of them sell drugs. But have a more sophisticated view of the matter and realize that there are thousands upon thousands of people out there who sell drugs to their group of friends/classmates/coworkers who don't fit into your stereotype at all. Speaking on the matter of cannabis, most of the good stuff is grown indoors in small amounts by people who learned how to do it via the internet...it's not always being shipped over the border from Mexican cartels armed with assault rifles.

                                                                                Comment


                                                                                • #41
                                                                                  Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                                                                                  You have your liberal opinion, I have mine.
                                                                                  Oh so it needs a label?


                                                                                  Originally posted by Irish YJ View Post
                                                                                  Also, you misread my post (first comment you made) and made assumptions that I want to give every first time dealer 10 years. Take a chill pill (or whatever substance you feel necessary).
                                                                                  Two years then. Is that better? Take an 18-year old guy and throw him in prison for two years because he is the guy his college classmates get their weed from....how is his life changed, and how the hell does that obvious result benefit society?

                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                  • #42
                                                                                    No big deal, I'm sure he'll be able to scrounge up a hackey sack or frisbee in the joint, and still make tie-dye shirts during arts and crafts time....

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                                                                                    • #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                                                                                      Those god damn English and their stupid drug research!!

                                                                                      Open up the ol' Google machine and see for yourself. The Swiss (Ew Europeans!) just concluded the first study of LSD in forty years, take a look.
                                                                                      You're the one trying to make a point. If you want to move people's opinions, then give them some facts. Then they can say, "After examining new evidence, I think maybe I have been wrongly looking at the situation." If you don't want to supply the evidence, then don't expect people to move their opinion.

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                                                                                      • #44
                                                                                        I clearly stated 'personally'...twice.

                                                                                        If others want to have major sympathy towards him, have at it. I don't. I simply don't feel sorry for drug dealers....at all. They know the risks and they accept them. It's simply my own personal opinion.
                                                                                        sigpic Silence implies consent.

                                                                                        Comment


                                                                                        • #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by NDinL.A. View Post
                                                                                          I clearly stated 'personally'...twice.

                                                                                          If others want to have major sympathy towards him, have at it. I don't. I simply don't feel sorry for drug dealers....at all. They know the risks and they accept them. It's simply my own personal opinion.
                                                                                          Ok? Can we discuss our personal opinions though? It is a discussion board.

                                                                                          Re: your point about knowing the risks, my point was that this kid couldn't have known the risks. It's not fathomable for an average person, who's only been given probation twice, to think "I'm going to get put in jail for the rest of my life if I get caught again." It's an unreasonable sentence that no 20-year kid with no knowledge of the law would ever think would be placed upon him.

                                                                                          Funnier than you in 2012.

                                                                                          Comment


                                                                                          • #46
                                                                                            Originally posted by greyhammer90 View Post
                                                                                            Ok? Can we discuss our personal opinions though? It is a discussion board.

                                                                                            Re: your point about knowing the risks, my point was that this kid couldn't have known the risks. It's not fathomable for an average person, who's only been given probation twice, to think "I'm going to get put in jail for the rest of my life if I get caught again." It's an unreasonable sentence that no 20-year kid with no knowledge of the law would ever think would be placed upon him.
                                                                                            Wait a minute. I've never been convicted of a crime or been on probation but it seems to me that the judge and/or his probation officer and/or his lawyer likely made it clear to him what the possible penalty for a 3rd offense would be. Why are you giving him the benefit of the doubt?

                                                                                            In my court room experience the judge at sentencing almost always warns the convicted of the consequences of his next offense.

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                                                                                            • #47
                                                                                              Originally posted by greyhammer90 View Post
                                                                                              Ok? Can we discuss our personal opinions though? It is a discussion board.

                                                                                              Re: your point about knowing the risks, my point was that this kid couldn't have known the risks. It's not fathomable for an average person, who's only been given probation twice, to think "I'm going to get put in jail for the rest of my life if I get caught again." It's an unreasonable sentence that no 20-year kid with no knowledge of the law would ever think would be placed upon him.
                                                                                              That's true as I comes. Would you put your child in timeout twice for something. Then kick the living shit out of him on the third go around? The progression of the punishment is silly. On top of that it's Lsd. COMEONMAN!

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                                                                                              • #48
                                                                                                Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post


                                                                                                LOCK HIM THE FUCK UP!

                                                                                                Or, use the information on how harmful drugs are to make a reasonable decision:

                                                                                                "Don't drink beer, man. That stuff will mess with your mind".

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                                                                                                • #49
                                                                                                  The thread title is a bit misleading. This young man did not get life for selling LSD. This young man got life for being a 3 time repeat offender and pleading guilty to a charge he should have pled not guilty to.

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                                                                                                  • #50
                                                                                                    Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                                                                                                    Oh so it needs a label?




                                                                                                    Two years then. Is that better? Take an 18-year old guy and throw him in prison for two years because he is the guy his college classmates get their weed from....how is his life changed, and how the hell does that obvious result benefit society?
                                                                                                    OK, here's a label..... argumentative-my-opinion-is-the-only-one-that-matters-liberal-pinion.

                                                                                                    I said giving to a friend should not be considered distribution....... If the guy has 100 hits however, he's not just giving it to a friend, and in that scenario I'm perfectly happy with him getting somewhere between 2 and 10 depending on the details. Also, I don't buy into the whole it's OK because it's this drug, not OK because it's that. I'm supportive of the legalization of pot, but if I go buy a pound, give a quarter to my friend, I know what the consequences are. If I'm stupid enough, or unlucky enough to get caught, I have no one else to blame but myself if I'm thrown into jail. If I had a 16 year old kid right now, I don't want one of his buddies "giving" him any drugs. There are lots of scenarios, and all should be considered. At the end of the day, if you decide to break the law knowing the consequences, can you really complain if you get busted. It's not like drugs are a requirement for healthy living. It's recreational. It's not like somebody outlawed water.
                                                                                                    The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down
                                                                                                    Of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee

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