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  • "Clear Red Line" on Iran's Nuclear Program?

    Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to deliver ‘clear red line’ speech on Iran’s nuclear ambitions to UN | World | News | National Post

    Israel Prime Minister calls for "red line" to be drawn on Iran's nuclear program. President Obama has a very tough decision to make very soon regarding the US's stance on backing Israel.


    What is everyone's take on the issue? How do you see it playing out?
    The one who knocks.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Walter White View Post
    ... How do you see it playing out?
    Rhetoric. Then a lot of campaigning. Then some rhetoric while campaigning. Then some more interviews, and then the debates.

    Seriously. Nothing Netanyahu can say will change anything the U.S. does right now. Either for or against Israel.

    Comment


    • #3
      Heard some "expert" talking today, said at the end of the day, the only ones that can keep Iran from getting a nuclear weapon are the Iranians.

      Probably some truth to that.
      Admit it. You looked at the avatar first.

      Comment


      • #4
        Isreal doesnt have the highest hope for support from Prez Obama....I know the feel among a large amount of the Jewish Community is disappointed in Obama's policies towards Isreal. I wish I had taken a pic of the billborad off the turnpike near Boca Raton when I was visiting the other week, that read "OYE VEA Obama....we have had enough!"

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by tadman95 View Post
          Heard some "expert" talking today, said at the end of the day, the only ones that can keep Iran from getting a nuclear weapon are the Iranians.

          Probably some truth to that.
          Yeah. And that sounds pretty scary when you say that out loud.

          Comment


          • #6
            WooHooo...more Wars we can't at all justify paying for....

            I love America and the regular hard working american people that make it up(you guys). But once I get the chance I can't wait to move abroad and live in a country that doesn't get tangled up in losing battles.

            Comment


            • #7
              It's a very interesting situation. Iran is 10x the opponent Iraq or North Korea were/are.

              Israel has the sovereign right to defend itself and wage war as it sees fit. If they do attack Iran, I hope the US stays the **** away from it. Sell them everything they need though, we could use the cash.

              Comment


              • #8
                Nuke and pave
                I do not like Brian Kelly as a coach.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                  It's a very interesting situation. Iran is 10x the opponent Iraq or North Korea were/are.

                  Israel has the sovereign right to defend itself and wage war as it sees fit. If they do attack Iran, I hope the US stays the **** away from it. Sell them everything they need though, we could use the cash.
                  +1...we need to stay as far away militarily if Israel chooses to do so...Sometimes we just need to chill and be Sweden

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Team America...World Police no longer!
                    We learned more from a three-minute record, than we ever learned in school...

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yeah we should stay away from Iran/Israel conflict because once Iran crushes Israel their power hungry, Islamic extremist, West hating, insane dictator of a leader will never consider attacking the USA next.
                      Last edited by bobbyok1; 09-27-2012, 03:00 PM.
                      When God does the big things, the little people get drawn in too. Human systems often forget that, but God doesn’t.- N.T. Wright "from "Simply Jesus"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I don't know. As much as we can't afford it, I'd hate the idea of Israel going it alone over there. First, it would be them versus Iran...and then the other mideast nations/groups/brotherhoods/clans would probably jump into the fray with their newfound Iranian best buds. Plus, does anybody really doubt Iran using a nuclear weapon, against somebody (if they have one)?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                          It's a very interesting situation. Iran is 10x the opponent Iraq or North Korea were/are.

                          Israel has the sovereign right to defend itself and wage war as it sees fit. If they do attack Iran, I hope the US stays the **** away from it. Sell them everything they need though, we could use the cash.
                          Absolutely. Arms manufacturing is extremely lucrative, and would definitely be a huge boost to our economy. Plus we would save on our already astronomical military budget because it is Israel fighting and not us thus turning those expenses into revenues instead.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by SaltyND24 View Post
                            +1...we need to stay as far away militarily if Israel chooses to do so...Sometimes we just need to chill and be Sweden
                            I think you mean Switzerland. Unless you mean we should support the war and/or invade them with Volvo's and Nokia phones. Maybe set up some IKEA military bases.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by CTIDANDREW View Post
                              WooHooo...more Wars we can't at all justify paying for....

                              I love America and the regular hard working american people that make it up(you guys). But once I get the chance I can't wait to move abroad and live in a country that doesn't get tangled up in losing battles.
                              I'm just curious which countries you are referring to that don't get "tangled up in losing battles."
                              “We make men without chests and expect from them virtue and enterprise. We laugh at honor and are shocked to find traitors in our midst.” C.S. Lewis

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by CTIDANDREW View Post
                                WooHooo...more Wars we can't at all justify paying for....

                                I love America and the regular hard working american people that make it up(you guys). But once I get the chance I can't wait to move abroad and live in a country that doesn't get tangled up in losing battles.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by FLDomer View Post
                                  Isreal doesnt have the highest hope for support from Prez Obama....I know the feel among a large amount of the Jewish Community is disappointed in Obama's policies towards Isreal. I wish I had taken a pic of the billborad off the turnpike near Boca Raton when I was visiting the other week, that read "OYE VEA Obama....we have had enough!"
                                  That seems to be a popular meme, but it is not true.

                                  Jewish Voters in U.S. Back Obama

                                  While Republicans may look favorably on Romney's visit to Israel, another group with keen interest in U.S.-Israeli relations -- Jewish Americans -- solidly backs Obama in the election.

                                  Gallup Daily tracking from June 1-July 26 finds Jewish registered voters favoring Obama over Romney by 68% to 25%. That is essentially the same as Gallup's prior update on Jewish voting preferences.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by CTIDANDREW View Post
                                    WooHooo...more Wars we can't at all justify paying for....

                                    I love America and the regular hard working american people that make it up(you guys). But once I get the chance I can't wait to move abroad and live in a country that doesn't get tangled up in losing battles.
                                    Peace.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Both countries are trouble.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by CHIDomer9 View Post
                                        That seems to be a popular meme, but it is not true.

                                        Jewish Voters in U.S. Back Obama
                                        The adds I saw on TV and the billboards were sponsored by the Jewish Council....just say

                                        Comment


                                        • #21
                                          As someone that use to live in Israel and have many friends there still....I am worried. $hit is about to hit the fan, Israelis are not really good at sitting idle while their neighbors load up.
                                          "The good lord put eyes in front of your head rather than in back so you can see where you're going rather than where you've been." Lou Holtz

                                          Comment


                                          • #22
                                            Originally posted by CHIDomer9
                                            That seems to be a popular meme, but it is not true.

                                            Jewish Voters in U.S. Back Obama

                                            Originally posted by FLDomer View Post
                                            The adds I saw on TV and the billboards were sponsored by the Jewish Council....just say
                                            Nothing new here. Whether Obama, Clinton, Carter, etc., Jewish voters have traditionally voted heavily democratic.

                                            "Although one goal of Romney's Israel visit could be to attract greater support among Jewish voters in the U.S., Jewish Americans have been a traditionally strong Democratic group, so they are unlikely to become much more supportive of Romney regardless of the outcome of the trip."
                                            Last edited by bobbyok1; 09-27-2012, 04:26 PM.
                                            When God does the big things, the little people get drawn in too. Human systems often forget that, but God doesn’t.- N.T. Wright "from "Simply Jesus"

                                            Comment


                                            • #23
                                              Can't not choose a side. That's what Walder Frey would do and he is an ultimate douche.

                                              Comment


                                              • #24
                                                Originally posted by Buster Bluth View Post
                                                It's a very interesting situation. Iran is 10x the opponent Iraq or North Korea were/are.

                                                Israel has the sovereign right to defend itself and wage war as it sees fit. If they do attack Iran, I hope the US stays the **** away from it. Sell them everything they need though, we could use the cash.
                                                I think everyone knows that wouldnt happen, the US would probly do most of the fighting, based on the way politicians suck up to israel.



                                                I see two scenarios :

                                                They get the nuke, they dont fire, neither doesnt anyone else, everyone shits themselves scared but war is averted


                                                They get pre-emptively struck by israel/us, hell breaks loose

                                                Comment


                                                • #25
                                                  Originally posted by irishog77 View Post
                                                  I don't know. As much as we can't afford it, I'd hate the idea of Israel going it alone over there. First, it would be them versus Iran...and then the other mideast nations/groups/brotherhoods/clans would probably jump into the fray with their newfound Iranian best buds. Plus, does anybody really doubt Iran using a nuclear weapon, against somebody (if they have one)?
                                                  YES. These gues might be anti-semetic *******s, but theyre one thing they care more about then Israel: THEMSELVES. They launch a nuke, they a pile of nuclear waste within hours, no doubt about it. Thats why I see them wanitng it just to even the playing field. Countries with nukes are highly feared and not ****ed with.

                                                  Comment


                                                  • #26
                                                    Originally posted by bobbyok1 View Post
                                                    Nothing new here. Whether Obama, Clinton, Carter, etc., Jewish voters have traditionally voted heavily democratic. ...
                                                    The Jewish vote started going Democrat around 1920. Many Jews were at the lower end of the economic scale working in sweat shops. Many were immigrants or the children of immigrants with home schooling in "the old country" pogroms and 2000 years of Diaspora. They were active in the labor movement, anti-slavery, women's voting, etc probably before the Democratic Party was. They were active in the NAACP and among the founders of the ACLU. Many supported the concept of communism as they identified with millennia of persecution.

                                                    They voted over 50% for Woodrow Wilson and firmly embraced FDR. Jimmy Carter's second election may be the only time since that they didn't vote a Democrat majority.

                                                    If there is a wedge issue for Jewish voters, "Next year in Jerusalem" would be it.

                                                    Comment


                                                    • #27
                                                      Originally posted by DSully1995 View Post
                                                      YES. These gues might be anti-semetic *******s, but theyre one thing they care more about then Israel: THEMSELVES. They launch a nuke, they a pile of nuclear waste within hours, no doubt about it. Thats why I see them wanitng it just to even the playing field. Countries with nukes are highly feared and not ****ed with.
                                                      I think they would use it. Iran is a theocracy. they are governed by their religion and consider the text the word of God. That means their actions are the actions of God. If they get a nuke it is to use it in God's name. Don't ever underestimate the craziness of religious nuts.

                                                      Comment


                                                      • #28
                                                        Originally posted by jason_h537 View Post
                                                        I think they would use it. Iran is a theocracy. they are governed by their religion and consider the text the word of God. That means their actions are the actions of God. If they get a nuke it is to use it in God's name. Don't ever underestimate the craziness of religious nuts.
                                                        I have thought about that too, but these guys are use Islam like a tool for social control on the people, inside im sure they would rather palaces than a holy sacrifice.

                                                        Comment


                                                        • #29
                                                          Originally posted by DSully1995 View Post
                                                          I have thought about that too, but these guys are use Islam like a tool for social control on the people, inside im sure they would rather palaces than a holy sacrifice.
                                                          True. However, there have been leaders who don't think twice about killing their own people. Mutually Assured Destruction worked in the Cold War because the countries involved didn't want to destroy their citizens. High ranking Iranian officials have said what their goal is, to wipe Israel off the map, and Iran’s former President Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani has said, “application of an atomic bomb would not leave anything in Israel but the same thing would just produce damages in the Muslim world.” You can't compare what worked in the Cold War to what would work with this situation. The differences between the Soviet Union back then and the U.S. were largely ideological. That is not the case with Iran and Israel/America. The Soviet Union never used suicide bombers either. It would not be difficult for such leaders to give the order and be in a different part of the world while that order is executed.
                                                          "There is nothing to writing. All you do is sit down at a typewriter and bleed." E.H.

                                                          Comment


                                                          • #30
                                                            Originally posted by WaveDomer View Post
                                                            True. However, there have been leaders who don't think twice about killing their own people. Mutually Assured Destruction worked in the Cold War because the countries involved didn't want to destroy their citizens. High ranking Iranian officials have said what their goal is, to wipe Israel off the map, and Iran’s former President Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani has said, “application of an atomic bomb would not leave anything in Israel but the same thing would just produce damages in the Muslim world.” You can't compare what worked in the Cold War to what would work with this situation. The differences between the Soviet Union back then and the U.S. were largely ideological. That is not the case with Iran and Israel/America. The Soviet Union never used suicide bombers either. It would not be difficult for such leaders to give the order and be in a different part of the world while that order is executed.
                                                            Ya sure, they can run from it, leave theyre country and people, butr theyll get caught eventually theres no doubt.

                                                            Also, our media coverage of the ''wipe off the map''quote is misreprentative

                                                            <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tC54-297uUM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



                                                            Ofcourse they want israel gone (since they have a sensible argument that they, like newt gringrich said bout the palestinians, have no historical right to the holy land.

                                                            But to say that he would do this a another question

                                                            Comment


                                                            • #31
                                                              If i were to be black, and a fan of doing driving rants, I'd create almost this exact same video

                                                              <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qDB0A9tW0Nc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

                                                              Comment


                                                              • #32
                                                                Lets say that iran is able to produce a few ICMBs, there is no way they would be stupid enough to try a first strike against a US ally (especially considering the strong US prescense in the region currently). however if the Israelis launched a preemtive strike (nuclear or non) i feel like it would drag the US in to another war based mostly on airstrikes/dronestrikes/missles based from US warships in the region and Afghanistan ( there would be minimal support at home for a full land invasion of the country)
                                                                "In this room, we win. Out there, they get a chance to feel it." -Brian Kelly

                                                                Comment


                                                                • #33
                                                                  Originally posted by GreatGolson View Post
                                                                  Lets say that iran is able to produce a few ICMBs, there is no way they would be stupid enough to try a first strike against a US ally (especially considering the strong US prescense in the region currently). however if the Israelis launched a preemtive strike (nuclear or non) i feel like it would drag the US in to another war based mostly on airstrikes/dronestrikes/missles based from US warships in the region and Afghanistan ( there would be minimal support at home for a full land invasion of the country)
                                                                  Unless Iran could be blamed for a attack on the homeland, then its once again all hell breaks loose

                                                                  Comment


                                                                  • #34
                                                                    Originally posted by IrishLax View Post
                                                                    Can't not choose a side. That's what Walder Frey would do and he is an ultimate douche.
                                                                    Ha nice.

                                                                    Comment


                                                                    • #35
                                                                      Originally posted by GO IRISH!!! View Post
                                                                      I'm just curious which countries you are referring to that don't get "tangled up in losing battles."
                                                                      Canada?

                                                                      Comment


                                                                      • #36
                                                                        the US should steer clear of any conflict in the middle east and Israel. That region has been in conflict for 2000 years, to think that the US will have any role in stopping or preventing conflict in that region, is arrogant (to say the least) on a megalomanicial scale.
                                                                        YYZ by RUSH (cover) - (only the last half)
                                                                        Billie Stephens' Fiery Disaster -- Dancin' with Myself (partial cover)

                                                                        Comment


                                                                        • #37
                                                                          Let them blow themselves up trying. We need to quit being the big brother for awhile.
                                                                          Brotherhood may fade, but it will never run

                                                                          Comment


                                                                          • #38
                                                                            Originally posted by irishff1014 View Post
                                                                            Let them blow themselves up trying. We need to quit being the big brother for awhile.
                                                                            No, we need to quit being the dumba$$ uncle who is trying to tell his brother how to parent his kid, when the uncle's kid is sh!tstain delinquent.

                                                                            Comment


                                                                            • #39
                                                                              Originally posted by TDHeysus View Post
                                                                              the US should steer clear of any conflict in the middle east and Israel. That region has been in conflict for 2000 years, to think that the US will have any role in stopping or preventing conflict in that region, is arrogant (to say the least) on a megalomanicial scale.
                                                                              while i agree with your idea reguarding US action, i would argue that the middle east/palestine has seen long streches of peace under Pax Romana, the Mongol empire, and even druing the British occupation. bottom line, the area is a powederkeg right now, but it has not always been that way and certainly will not always be such a volatile area
                                                                              "In this room, we win. Out there, they get a chance to feel it." -Brian Kelly

                                                                              Comment


                                                                              • #40
                                                                                If someone said they would kill you, would you take it seriously, or would you shrug it off? Now what if they said that they not only wanted to kill you, but they would also go after everyone that you knew and loved and all that you hold dear, to literally wipe you off the face of the map? Now what if they told you that not only did they want to, but they also thought it was the will of God? At what point would it register that they mean what they said?

                                                                                As for Mr. Obama, he sent the Churchill bust back to England, told Russia to wait until after the election to screw our allies- when he has more flexibility, and won't even recognize the capital of Israel as Jerusalem.

                                                                                Mr. Obama's "bumps in the road" were living, breathing people, serving their country. Instead of acting on a warning that they had days in advance, when their death could have been avoided, instead of serving the people he served them up as a sacrifice. To blame this on a video is moronic and laughable.

                                                                                The only thing I would count on Mr. Obama for is to nearly double our national debt, endear himself and endanger the people of our great nation by associating with known anarchists and the Muslim Brotherhood, work on his golf game, try to fundraise and try to get elected again.

                                                                                I hate to say this, but I genuinely fear for Israel. This runs much deeper than politics, and we do not have he right President to answer the call for help.

                                                                                Israel is our only true ally in the middle east. It would be reprehensible for us to stand by and do nothing in the name of political correctness. It would shame me as an American.

                                                                                God protect them please. In Jesus's Name, Amen.

                                                                                So...what would you do if you were in their shoes?
                                                                                God deserves a promotion.

                                                                                Comment


                                                                                • #41
                                                                                  War with Iran would be just as easy as Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. It's the keeping the peace part that we struggle with. If it comes to it, let the military do their thing, and let Saudi do the nation building.

                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                  • #42
                                                                                    Both sides need to find Jesus.....

                                                                                    I'd love to stay out of it, but you know that will never happen if something does start. If we do jump in,,,,, level all the threats. Don't dip a toe in, don't send ground forces in, just level everything and let the peace keepers come in later and clean it up.
                                                                                    The legend lives on from the Chippewa on down
                                                                                    Of the big lake they called Gitche Gumee

                                                                                    Comment


                                                                                    • #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by DSully1995 View Post
                                                                                      I have thought about that too, but these guys are use Islam like a tool for social control on the people, inside im sure they would rather palaces than a holy sacrifice.
                                                                                      ya know...until recently I would have disagreed...but the more I look into it, the more I find VERY FEW of these "leaders" live the life they espouse...Achmadickintheass...I don't know about him, specifically. We now have some indication OBL was a pussy, and wouldn't even fight for what he "believed in", and talked so many others into kiling themselves for. That guy was a hypocritical coward beatch...I'd guess Achmadickintheass to be the same...spin up everyone else, preach hate, but don't mess with his weekly porn feed, big Mac, fries , and coke.

                                                                                      Although, as a humanitarian mission, someone should open a third eye in that guy's forehead too.
                                                                                      One equal temper of heroic hearts, Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will. To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

                                                                                      Comment


                                                                                      • #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by pumpdog20 View Post
                                                                                        War with Iran would be just as easy as Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. It's the keeping the peace part that we struggle with. If it comes to it, let the military do their thing, and let Saudi do the nation building.
                                                                                        Amen.
                                                                                        One equal temper of heroic hearts, Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will. To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

                                                                                        Comment


                                                                                        • #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by Walter White View Post
                                                                                          Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to deliver ‘clear red line’ speech on Iran’s nuclear ambitions to UN | World | News | National Post

                                                                                          Israel Prime Minister calls for "red line" to be drawn on Iran's nuclear program. President Obama has a very tough decision to make very soon regarding the US's stance on backing Israel.


                                                                                          What is everyone's take on the issue? How do you see it playing out?
                                                                                          The thing that bothers me so much about this is the timing of Netanyahu in his attempt to make this a real issue in the US. To me, it is clear he is trying to inject this issue into the presidential race and hopes he can box Obama in to give him support - or damage Obama in key states like Florida so he can get a more favorable administration. Obama shouldn't take the bait - and if he gets elected he should make him pay for this move. Last time I checked the US backs Israel to the hilt. Trying to get the US to agree to a red line to go to war to support his agenda (and I think it's important to note that a large segment of people in Israel, perhaps 50% or more, don't themselves support a red line or bombing Iran). No one gets to decide when America goes to war, except Americans. Also, when a country that gets significant money from the US and support starts trying to influence our elections, it's time to push back in demonstrable ways.

                                                                                          Perhaps I'm missing some key facts, but this is just my gut reaction.

                                                                                          Comment


                                                                                          • #46
                                                                                            Originally posted by DSully1995 View Post
                                                                                            Ya sure, they can run from it, leave theyre country and people, butr theyll get caught eventually theres no doubt.

                                                                                            Also, our media coverage of the ''wipe off the map''quote is misreprentative

                                                                                            <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/tC54-297uUM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



                                                                                            Ofcourse they want israel gone (since they have a sensible argument that they, like newt gringrich said bout the palestinians, have no historical right to the holy land.

                                                                                            But to say that he would do this a another question
                                                                                            First, I don't really care what Newt says. ;)

                                                                                            Second, you're right about that translation. However, there have been signs put up in military parades that say essentially the same thing. I'm not really trying to pick a side, my point was mainly that there is enough evidence out there that you can't be assured that threat of nuclear retaliation is a deterrent for Iran.
                                                                                            "There is nothing to writing. All you do is sit down at a typewriter and bleed." E.H.

                                                                                            Comment


                                                                                            • #47
                                                                                              Originally posted by WaveDomer View Post
                                                                                              First, I don't really care what Newt says. ;)

                                                                                              Second, you're right about that translation. However, there have been signs put up in military parades that say essentially the same thing. I'm not really trying to pick a side, my point was mainly that there is enough evidence out there that you can't be assured that threat of nuclear retaliation is a deterrent for Iran.
                                                                                              I mentioned him just out of the blue, but it was mostly to remain neutral, both sides can pull out the ``you have no historical right for the land`` cards, but the jews even less since there have been muslim states before

                                                                                              Comment


                                                                                              • #48
                                                                                                Originally posted by DSully1995 View Post
                                                                                                I mentioned him just out of the blue, but it was mostly to remain neutral, both sides can pull out the ``you have no historical right for the land`` cards, but the jews even less since there have been muslim states before
                                                                                                Just giving you "you know what." ;)
                                                                                                "There is nothing to writing. All you do is sit down at a typewriter and bleed." E.H.

                                                                                                Comment


                                                                                                • #49
                                                                                                  Originally posted by TDHeysus View Post
                                                                                                  the US should steer clear of any conflict in the middle east and Israel. That region has been in conflict for 2000 years, to think that the US will have any role in stopping or preventing conflict in that region, is arrogant (to say the least) on a megalomanicial scale.
                                                                                                  $$$$$ trumps all

                                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                                  • #50
                                                                                                    Originally posted by TDHeysus View Post
                                                                                                    the US should steer clear of any conflict in the middle east and Israel. That region has been in conflict for 2000 years, to think that the US will have any role in stopping or preventing conflict in that region, is arrogant (to say the least) on a megalomanicial scale.
                                                                                                    Double it.

                                                                                                    Comment

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