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Old 12-01-2014, 12:26 PM   #183 (permalink)
T Town Tommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishLax View Post
Looking at opinion polls is worthless. Here's how to consider if the SEC is overrated. Per Sagarin Predictor (pretty much the best "strength" rating system out there)...

1. Alabama
3. Ole Miss
4. Georgia
5. Mississippi State
6. Auburn
11. Arkansas (who is 6-6...)
12. LSU
18. Missouri
19. Florida
24. Texas A&M
25. Tennessee

Pretty much the entire SEC is in the top 25 of an unbiased computer poll. So that empirical evidence says SEC > all. The only non-SEC team in the top 6 is TCU.

Alternatively, if you look at "Vegas" rankings which literally just ask the question "who is the BEST team? and who would be favored over who and by how much?"

From BEFORE this week's actions:
1. Alabama (2 points clear of the rest of CFB... before beating Auburn...)
2. Baylor/Oregon
4. FSU/Georgia/Ohio State
7. UCLA
8. Wisconsin
9. Michigan State/Oklahoma

Will be interesting to see where these sit after this week's action, but you only had 2 SEC teams in the top 10... and one lost to Georgia Tech. UCLA also lost to Stanford though. But per an aggregate on Vegas linesmakers, after Alabama there is a BIG drop off in strength to the other SEC teams... even in the West.

Outside of Georgia, there are no SEC East teams in the top 25 of Vegas' objective "strength" ratings.
That's nice. So where would a healthy Notre Dame fall in the SEC? Or, in particular, the SEC West?

Here's my take Lax. ND fans spend way too much time trying to justify their team and/or trying to downplay everyone else. Neither is really proactive. As far as the SEC... at the end of the day I care about Alabama and Ky (my home state.) Every other team can win or lose and it doesn't really matter that much to me. But the constant posting that the SEC is overrated/not good/ yada yada is really old. Worry about how ND is going to close the talent gap, keep their players healthy, win the games they are in. Who really gives a damn at the end of the day if the team we cheer for isn't playing for the title?

Last edited by T Town Tommy; 12-01-2014 at 12:45 PM..
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Old 12-01-2014, 12:43 PM   #184 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T Town Tommy View Post
That's nice. So where would a healthy Notre Dame fall in the SEC? Or, in particular, the SEC West?
Alabama 7-1
Mississippi State 6-2
Ole Miss 5-3
Auburn 4-4
LSU 4-4
Texas A&M 3-5
Arkansas 2-6

Realistically we would be battling with the bottom three if we are lucky. Would be hard for our offense to score consistently on LSU, Ole Miss, Alabama, and Arkansas, and we couldn't out score Auburn.
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Old 12-01-2014, 01:22 PM   #185 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T Town Tommy View Post
That's nice. So where would a healthy Notre Dame fall in the SEC? Or, in particular, the SEC West?
Huh? I said in other threads that ND would lose to a competent MAC team right now with this sorry excuse for a defense, so what's your point?

If actually asking the question legitimately... as of before last week (where ND got blown out, lost another MIKE, lost two more safeties, and now has no healthy defensive tackles left on the entire roster after losing two more) ND was rated better by Vegas than every team in the SEC East besides Georgia, and in the West behind Alabama, Mississippi State, Auburn, LSU, Mississippi, and Arkansas.

Sagarin (reflecting this week) slots ND at #29 behind all the teams listed above.

Quote:
Here's my take Lax. ND fans spend way too much time trying to justify their team and/or trying to downplay everyone else.
Yeah, this is just total ignorant BS. I have scarce seen ANYONE talk about ND "deserving" more or being "underrated" since Joe Schmidt, Sheldon Day, Jarron Jones, and Cody Riggs all picked up injuries heading up to ASU. I think ND fans are actually far MORE realistic, pragmatic, and informed about their team than general college football fans.

Quote:
Neither is really proactive. As far as the SEC... at the end of the day I care about Alabama and Ky (my home state.) Every other team can win or lose and it doesn't really matter that much to me. But the constant posting that the SEC is overrated/not good/ yada yada is really old. Worry about how ND is going to close the talent gap, keep their players healthy, win the games they are in. Who really gives a damn at the end of the day if the team we cheer for isn't playing for the title?
And this is just super stupid. A discussion board is made for discussion.

We have a thread on Ferguson. We have a thread on politics. We have a thread on coaching changes around the country. We have a whole sub-forum for "Other College Football"... and you think we shouldn't use it because we should "worry about our own team" is, at best, illogical. It's not like any of us have an office in the Gug where we could re-allocate our time to doing something that would actually improve our team. Nor do any of us function as Bag Men.

So discussing which conferences are better than others ON A COLLEGE FOOTBALL BOARD seems like a rather acceptable use of time. Sorry if it upsets your constitution when anyone questions the ultimate supremacy of the South Eastern Conference.
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Old 12-01-2014, 01:41 PM   #186 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishLax View Post
Looking at opinion polls is worthless. Here's how to consider if the SEC is overrated. Per Sagarin Predictor (pretty much the best "strength" rating system out there)...

1. Alabama
3. Ole Miss
4. Georgia
5. Mississippi State
6. Auburn
11. Arkansas (who is 6-6...)
12. LSU
18. Missouri
19. Florida
24. Texas A&M
25. Tennessee

Pretty much the entire SEC is in the top 25 of an unbiased computer poll. So that empirical evidence says SEC > all. The only non-SEC team in the top 6 is TCU.

Alternatively, if you look at "Vegas" rankings which literally just ask the question "who is the BEST team? and who would be favored over who and by how much?"

From BEFORE this week's actions:
1. Alabama (2 points clear of the rest of CFB... before beating Auburn...)
2. Baylor/Oregon
4. FSU/Georgia/Ohio State
7. UCLA
8. Wisconsin
9. Michigan State/Oklahoma

Will be interesting to see where these sit after this week's action, but you only had 2 SEC teams in the top 10... and one lost to Georgia Tech. UCLA also lost to Stanford though. But per an aggregate on Vegas linesmakers, after Alabama there is a BIG drop off in strength to the other SEC teams... even in the West.

Outside of Georgia, there are no SEC East teams in the top 25 of Vegas' objective "strength" ratings.
Some of these SEC teams in the Sagarin rankings (and I agree with you about Sagarin) are just hard to justify, or at least know about for sure. Arkansas at 6-6 is greatly improved and certainly not the same team today as they were 3 months ago. Tennessee has improved also, but UGA is just an enigma. They can look like an NFL team one week and a MAC school's scout team the next. Auburn has been all over the map also. The team that almost beat us this weekend bears no resemblance to the team that got slaughtered by UGA a couple of weeks ago. LSU has been up & down. The two Mississippi schools have looked great at times and then pedestrian at others. Mizzou has looked awesome one week and ridiculous the next.

I honestly have no idea if all those teams belong on that list or only 1 or 2 of them do. Heck of a confusing, up & down season for most of the SEC teams this year. Other than Bama just being Bama, the rest of the conference has been schizo.
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Old 12-01-2014, 01:52 PM   #187 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishLax View Post
Huh? I said in other threads that ND would lose to a competent MAC team right now with this sorry excuse for a defense, so what's your point?

If actually asking the question legitimately... as of before last week (where ND got blown out, lost another MIKE, lost two more safeties, and now has no healthy defensive tackles left on the entire roster after losing two more) ND was rated better by Vegas than every team in the SEC East besides Georgia, and in the West behind Alabama, Mississippi State, Auburn, LSU, Mississippi, and Arkansas.

Sagarin (reflecting this week) slots ND at #29 behind all the teams listed above.



Yeah, this is just total ignorant BS. I have scarce seen ANYONE talk about ND "deserving" more or being "underrated" since Joe Schmidt, Sheldon Day, Jarron Jones, and Cody Riggs all picked up injuries heading up to ASU. I think ND fans are actually far MORE realistic, pragmatic, and informed about their team than general college football fans.



And this is just super stupid. A discussion board is made for discussion.

We have a thread on Ferguson. We have a thread on politics. We have a thread on coaching changes around the country. We have a whole sub-forum for "Other College Football"... and you think we shouldn't use it because we should "worry about our own team" is, at best, illogical. It's not like any of us have an office in the Gug where we could re-allocate our time to doing something that would actually improve our team. Nor do any of us function as Bag Men.

So discussing which conferences are better than others ON A COLLEGE FOOTBALL BOARD seems like a rather acceptable use of time. Sorry if it upsets your constitution when anyone questions the ultimate supremacy of the South Eastern Conference.
You missed my points Lax. Long before any injuries and long before this season, a lot of posters out here spent most of their time trying to legitimize ND and downplay every other team in the country. There is a reason why the SEC is talked about constantly out here.

As far as discussion, I agree 100%. My point was the fact that if my team isn't playing for the title, then I really don't care who wins it. I love discussing the games, matchups, etc., but at the end of the day, I don't care who really wins... my team didn't so I don't care.

I question the constant downplaying of a conference that has dominated college football and some people's inability to understand that. To constantly take cheap shots, bad mouth, and otherwise discount what that conference has accomplished is BS. You know it and I know it. And to not be able to objectively look at teams because one looks through their own baises is BS. Take the uniforms off and evaluate teams. More times than not, that isn't the case out here. It is the SEC is overrated... even though they typically dominate the latest "johnny come lately" team in the title game, their criminals, they cheat, they do this they do that. What they do is win... and win against the best this sport has had to offer the last decade. I think it is sad that it appears the last 25 years of ND football has bred hatred for any one team, one conference, etc. It sure seems to have eroded some's ability to look at teams and decide whether they are good or not. What other conference can have a 2-6 team as good as Arkansas is and the only argument posted out here is they suck... their 2-6. Let's be real Lax.
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Old 12-01-2014, 01:54 PM   #188 (permalink)
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ACC (Who FSU is getting ripped on for rolling through because it's supposedly a terrible conference) was 4-0 against SEC yesterday. Just saying.
In the SEC's defense, the East and the West are polar opposites.
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Old 12-01-2014, 02:10 PM   #189 (permalink)
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...ND fans spend way too much time trying to justify their team and/or trying to downplay everyone else.
No offense, but isn't criticizing the way "ND fans spend their time" just a little ironic coming from an Alabama fan with 3,000+ posts on a Notre Dame internet message board...?

And I have some thoughts of my own about the way Alabama fans spend their time (NSFW), but that deserves its own thread.
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